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2012 whats your take??
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Disco_Destroyer
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:00 am    Post subject: 2012 whats your take?? Reply with quote

I'd class this as the most important message I have to offer at the moment. I look at 2012 with fear, not for what the claims are but more that most people have openly embraced the idea and therefore feel they are already saved! That is the part I fear, we are being led to believe the age old line that a Hero or Messiah will save us and we need not do a thing. Even avid Truthers on the board and elsewhere believe this!
I believe this is infact an error and possibly deliberately placed to make us take any sh*t that they can throw at us. Also the term 'End of life as we know it' may well be the finalisation of a Global Orwellian Dictatorship where we have no escape. It may just pass like all the other dates thrown at us by the MSM that have passed with no event (except the passing of more draconian laws and making it generally harder for the under privaleged) remember 2000, the computer bug scare and the planets arranging to form the Four Horsemen. All passed with no incident and no explaination why the media created such a fuss!!
So to sum up, I believe that 2012 will probably pass and another date will be offered up while all the time our leaders rob us blind!
I believe the only change will come from us and that it must be in our hearts, everybody wants change even non truthers, that is the power we have to awaken, by our own hands and not by relying on some hero or mystical being to save us Wink

Anyway fire away 2012 approaches as rapidly as ever Wink

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

2012 marks the year of the Olympic games in London and that's it. Apart from deep global recession due to high oil prices, wars in the Middle East and the end of the dollar it will be business as usual.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Surely you are aware that others place far more significance on the date than merely the date of the London Olympics, James.

Now whether you place any credance in these beliefs yourself is irrelevant. The fact is others do and this is significant

2012 and the maya

2012 and armageddon

2012 and the second coming

2012 and end times

2012 and rapture

Given the elite's use of religion both now and historically to divide and control humanity and the PTBs pre-occupation of framing the debate around the so-called war on terror in religious terms and as a clash of civilisations, then it is IMO naive to dismiss 2012 as just another date and dismiss concepts such as armageddon, second comings, 12th imam, end times, rapture and so forth as just superstitious mumbo-jumbo. The fact is if enough people believe in something it beceomes a self fulfilling prophesy. That is how life works.

If enough people believe that 9/11 truth will be the catalyst for a global awakening of peace, justice and truth then it will happen. Equally if enough people believe armageddon is inevitable, then that is what happens. Beliefs are very powerful regardless of whether they are actually 'true' or not.
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James C
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ian neal wrote:
Surely you are aware that others place far more significance on the date than merely the date of the London Olympics, James.

Now whether you place any credance in these beliefs yourself is irrelevant. The fact is others do and this is significant

2012 and the maya

2012 and armageddon

2012 and the second coming

2012 and end times

2012 and rapture

Given the elite's use of religion both now and historically to divide and control humanity and the PTBs pre-occupation of framing the debate around the so-called war on terror in religious terms and as a clash of civilisations, then it is IMO naive to dismiss 2012 as just another date and dismiss concepts such as armageddon, second comings, 12th imam, end times, rapture and so forth as just superstitious mumbo-jumbo. The fact is if enough people believe in something it beceomes a self fulfilling prophesy. That is how life works.

If enough people believe that 9/11 truth will be the catalyst for a global awakening of peace, justice and truth then it will happen. Equally if enough people believe armageddon is inevitable, then that is what happens. Beliefs are very powerful regardless of whether they are actually 'true' or not.


I am very aware what a few people say about 2012 but since I disagree with them the view in my previous post remains.

Although I agree that changing the world is a numbers game I don't see that a few Maya cultists are going to rouse the hearts and minds of your everyday folk who are far more interested in Coronation Street than minority religious beliefs.

I would suggest that you read this article before continuing down the majority rules argument.


Last edited by James C on Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ian neal wrote:


Given the elite's use of religion both now and historically to divide and control humanity and the PTBs pre-occupation of framing the debate around the so-called war on terror in religious terms and as a clash of civilisations, then it is IMO naive to dismiss 2012 as just another date and dismiss concepts such as armageddon, second comings, 12th imam, end times, rapture and so forth as just superstitious mumbo-jumbo. The fact is if enough people believe in something it beceomes a self fulfilling prophesy. That is how life works.

If enough people believe that 9/11 truth will be the catalyst for a global awakening of peace, justice and truth then it will happen. Equally if enough people believe armageddon is inevitable, then that is what happens. Beliefs are very powerful regardless of whether they are actually 'true' or not.


Very well put Ian. personally I dont think it a coincidence that so much info that has been hidden, hoarded & suppressed for so long is now finding its way to the people(us) with dizzying speed.
But is this info finding its way into the collective consciousness at this time despite the best efforts of the elite to keep it under wraps or is it being released now covertly with the appearance of a revolution?
Im not sure but I lean toward the former as the sources of info and the content is surely to diverse to be designed and controlled.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

James I found these docus really interesting while trying to find out a bit about how the mayan calender worked and the differences to how we use our calender. enjoy

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=1030536695965417017&q=ian+lu ngold&total=70&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-2832986272853534626&q=ian+l ungold&total=70&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=1

Very Happy

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mr nice wrote:
ian neal wrote:


Given the elite's use of religion both now and historically to divide and control humanity and the PTBs pre-occupation of framing the debate around the so-called war on terror in religious terms and as a clash of civilisations, then it is IMO naive to dismiss 2012 as just another date and dismiss concepts such as armageddon, second comings, 12th imam, end times, rapture and so forth as just superstitious mumbo-jumbo. The fact is if enough people believe in something it beceomes a self fulfilling prophesy. That is how life works.

If enough people believe that 9/11 truth will be the catalyst for a global awakening of peace, justice and truth then it will happen. Equally if enough people believe armageddon is inevitable, then that is what happens. Beliefs are very powerful regardless of whether they are actually 'true' or not.


Very well put Ian. personally I dont think it a coincidence that so much info that has been hidden, hoarded & suppressed for so long is now finding its way to the people(us) with dizzying speed.
But is this info finding its way into the collective consciousness at this time despite the best efforts of the elite to keep it under wraps or is it being released now covertly with the appearance of a revolution?
Im not sure but I lean toward the former as the sources of info and the content is surely to diverse to be designed and controlled.


The only coincidence is that we now have the internet which can spread a multitude of theories on just about anything, most of which are just bull' as is this topic. Sorry mr nice but I beg to differ with you as I do with Ian.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hey all cool james not trying to convert ya or anything!
Ive heard it said that technology is the foot print of consciousness so I suppose if the mayans were on the money then the internet and all those other clever gadgets are just the symptoms of the run up to 2012......
But hell seems to me things are coming to a head as you pointed out mate war,economic chaos,police state all in front of the TV addled masses.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mr nice wrote:
hey all cool james not trying to convert ya or anything!
Ive heard it said that technology is the foot print of consciousness so I suppose if the mayans were on the money then the internet and all those other clever gadgets are just the symptoms of the run up to 2012......
But hell seems to me things are coming to a head as you pointed out mate war,economic chaos,police state all in front of the TV addled masses.


No worries and thanks for the links, I'm watching the first one now.

But you are right, something is coming to a head and its quite simple, the world is running out of energy, particularly oil, and the largest consumer of this energy, the US, is doing all it can to take control of the remaining resources.

9/11 was due to this fact as was Iraq, as will be Iran and so on. Dick Cheney knows it, the Bush family knows it, Tony Blair was made to know it and it will shape our immediate future like no other event in recent history.

So I'd suggest that you forget about what the Maya may or may not say or what research 1st world astrologists have done into this calender, the true reality is that it is the decline in secure supplies of energy, which we needed to continue our way of life and maintain our economy, that is causing problems and not some religion. So goodbye western way of living, hello war, famine, poverty and death. Sorry!

If you want some real answers then I suggest you come to understand peak oil. Try this website for starters - Wolf at the door

No doubt religious cults worldwide will have field day on this one but the reality is it is our own greed and not a God which will make our futures so hard.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those at the top of the monetary pyramid want our power as well as our money.
By getting us all fearful saying there is a decline in resources serves us well in making us grovelling, fearful obedient servants to their wims.
I wont stand for this fear propaganda any more. I am an enviromentalist but its got Gore at the forefront of this now and I am not going to be part of that game.

Im a believer, but I dont think any Messiah is coming on 2012. Hes /Its already here, just have to get on to the right frequency.
I think the build up to 2012 is already started. Things are getting worse. I think the Olympics will bring changes to the city and the whole country,maybe even more laws will come quickly to the fore. They cant enslave our minds though.
Stay strong, stay in your centre. peace

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For those who havent already seen it. Interesting. Not gospel or anyhting.
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-8545585184878490822

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I personaly thing it's a perfect psyop directed at the New Age movement.

It has the same effect the rapture is having, of netrealising opposition to the NWO agenda. I know this from personal experience - truthers are laying down hoping for some interdomensional saviour to take responsiblilty for them.

As we all know the major religions and movements are all managed by the power elite. Why should we thing the 2012 thing is any different?

If only we could all just beleive in ourselves and act without fear then we could defeat these inbred scum.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent Tsarion article here:
http://www.taroscopes.com/miscellanous-pages/weapons.html

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been working with Mayan calendars since about 1998 and was first drawn in by the fact that the CHANGE point of the long count calendar is within my life time. I specifically use the word change as 11:11 on 21st december 2012 is not an end point, just as midnight is not an end point, just a change point. it seems to be increasingly apparent that on that date we will have an opportunity to look back and see how far we have come. no messiah coming as such, no big event, but maybe the combination of the many events happening in the 13 years previous. just look how much things have changed around you since 1999, did you have an e-mail address then, or a phone that you could get the internet on, or a mobile phone at all? technology is advancing exponentially, as are we, although of course there are some members of the 'human' race who seems to be trying to keep us from advancing (by that i do not mean that i think bush and blair etc are not human, just that i consider them sub-human!)

I feel it may be the time when we realise that we have come out of the other side of something big. for example, collapse of the oil markets or financial institutions, which will be 'the end of the world +as we know it' the maori describe it as the time when the veils will dissolve. maybe it will be the time that the worlds population see things for what they really are.

I would strongly suggest having a look at this book. If you are interested, it will be the best £14 you can spend on the matter

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Beyond-2012-Catastrophe-End-time/dp/095506080X  /ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/203-6713628-6257533?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1194800666&s r=8-1
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Winter solstice 2012 marks the gateway point, the event horizon for the next stage of consciousness and the evolution from duality to oneness. For me, it can be likened to a galactic 'on-line'. Will it happen at exactly 11.11hrs on 21 Dec 2012? Who knows. I do know that at this precise moment, as predicted by the Maya, the Sun aligns with the galactic centre. The simple fact that the Maya's were correct in this prediction has led me on a journey of personal discovery with the Maya teachings.

These guys are telling us something!

http://alignment2012.com/whatisGA.htm

To find out more about 2012 look no further than Geoff Strays work 'Beyond 2012'. This book summarises almost 20 years of study on the subject of 2012. Geoff plays a mean harmonica too!

Geoff Site: http://www.diagnosis2012.co.uk/

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

War is war! 'Be mindful of the force young Padawan' Very Happy

what I see unfolding is a world war for greed and power, they use whatever tools and propaganda necessary to sway the masses, don't become fools to the drumbeat Wink
We must do what it takes (well try) or turn a blind eye, that is the option I see. As I said I believe it is yet another in a long list of smokescreens, why wait for change.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interesting, I'm moving this to 'the bigger picture'.

Surely it's mostly to do with spreading fear much like the 'millenium bug' was supposed to do? I don't have a lot of time for the Mayan religion which used public beheadings and Rollerball style sports to keep the Mayan masses in fear.

I have heard from several oil industry sources that 2026 will also be a significant year when all sorts of suppressed energy technologies will be released.

I'm afraid that weakness in all the key institutions of the world (UN etc.) has left global planning to nutters and oligarchs who plan this big stuff in secret in their own self-interest and cocking a snook at the rest of us.



I reckon they do have something big planned for theat year but it will almost certainly be another massive confidence trick.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My position is that there is a risk that people with power and influence believe 2012 means something, and we shouldn't be flippant about it.

True, people have always wanted armeggedon - and new dates have rapidly been offered as old ones have past - the difference is that in the past they had to look to god for their fire and brimstone, and god wasn't playing their game. Now we have nuclear, biological, chemical weapons and who knows what else under wraps - for the first time we can make it happen.

Prophecies fulfil themselves when people with the power to make them happen believe in them.

If a few people in the wrong places believe 2012 has some significance - (and the obsession with numerology in "certain circles", religious beliefs of Zionists; christian and Jewish, not to mention the likelyhood of someone liking the symbolism of making something happen then, would all suggest there may just be) it would be foolish to wave it away as though it were nothing more than a superstition.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TonyGosling wrote:
I have heard from several oil industry sources that 2026 will also be a significant year when all sorts of suppressed energy technologies will be released.


Tony,

I've asked you this before; can you provide evidence that this will be the case? Who are these oil industry sources?
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 7:14 pm    Post subject: some interesting ideas here - planet x Reply with quote

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUtPRyXgO0A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O96ZMPXuv1A&feature=related
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't identify them, so it's just a rumour,

James C wrote:
TonyGosling wrote:
I have heard from several oil industry sources that 2026 will also be a significant year when all sorts of suppressed energy technologies will be released.


Tony,

I've asked you this before; can you provide evidence that this will be the case? Who are these oil industry sources?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

never mind 2012. watch out for 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the 2012 date has been taken out of context by doom sayers imo.

the mayan calender certainly ends on that date or near that date. which is what sparks alot of theorys off. but considering around this time the sun moves into aquarius it becomes obvious why the calender ends. because it starts again from scratch in the age of aquarius, simple.


Quote:
watch out for 2008


you could at least say why! rather than leave us sat here wondering whats gonna happen in 2008.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

marky 54 wrote:
but considering around this time the sun moves into aquarius it becomes obvious why the calender ends. because it starts again from scratch in the age of aquarius, simple.


But the zodiac starts in aries, not aquarius...why/how is aquarius relevant to the maya?


If alas nothing happens and New Years Day 2013 rolls around with the old familiar hangover and scatterings of spent fireworks, I want to see "Icke vs Shayler" in a battle to the death for the Ian Lungold "idiot false messiah" Trophy...the winner has his entire bogus testimony of bizarro theories about god-heads and yeshua incarnates, pole shifts and the universe changing shape wiped from all media and a chance to start a normal life again.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 12:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think only Shayler qualifies for the Yeshua incarnate
2012 is sticking on the agenda of those now in power
Most of their dates now end there, including compulsory id
This upgrade is being slowed down by their need to push the evolutionary agenda back by their acquired technology
Nothing much will happen on this date other than a consciousness upgrade for the few, due to their manipulation via haarp, chemtrails and mobile phone masts which attempt to keep the general apotheosis in check
That's the technology we must disable if we want to allow the incoming vibrations

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lee wrote:

Quote:
If alas nothing happens and New Years Day 2013 rolls around with the old familiar hangover and scatterings of spent fireworks, I want to see "Icke vs Shayler" in a battle to the death for the Ian Lungold "idiot false messiah" Trophy...the winner has his entire bogus testimony of bizarro theories about god-heads and yeshua incarnates, pole shifts and the universe changing shape wiped from all media and a chance to start a normal life again


I know you are being light hearted and humerous but check David Icke's latest book out - he doesn't give too much credence to the exact date of 2012 and he is certainly not suggesting for one moment that he is a messiah. We are ALL 'messiahs' in the sense we are all equally a part of the Infinite Consciousness/Possibility/Awareness/Love - ie: all droplets in the same ocean of energy. The other David, bless him, needs understanding and help.

http://www.davidickebooks.co.uk/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=50

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How many fake raptures does it take before people realise that there isn't going to be one?
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
But the zodiac starts in aries, not aquarius...why/how is aquarius relevant to the maya?


the sun takes thousands of years to travel through each consilation, the sun will enter aquarius on or around the date the mayan calender ends.
which will bring in a new age, the old age will end.

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=4936960216127154731&q=aquari us+maya&total=13&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=9

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=4936960216127154731&q=aquari us+maya&total=13&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=9

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=4936960216127154731&q=aquari us+maya&total=13&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=9

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-5102326498797631000&q=age+o f+aquarius+duration%3Amedium&total=133&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search &plindex=3

ive left some quick links i did'nt pick any especially i just grabbed random ones, so people can get enough information to then go and find out themselves.
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xmasdale
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter


Joined: 25 Jul 2005
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Location: South London

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know. How could I know? I'm no prophet.

The words of a hymn come to my mind:

Lead, kindly Light, amid th’encircling gloom, lead Thou me on!
The night is dark, and I am far from home; lead Thou me on!
Keep Thou my feet; I do not ask to see
The distant scene; one step enough for me.


Also to mind come the teachings of optimistic New Age prophet, Benjamin Creme, who maintains that the World Teacher (known to different religions as the Christ, Messiah, Imam Mahdi, Buddah Maitreya, Bhoddisatva) is already in the world and influencing the forces of goodness as the old ways of the Piscean age pass away and the new ways of Aquarius enter. Nevertheless, he maintains, we have to do it for ourselves. The World Teacher by doing it himself would violate the principle of human free will. He can therefore only guide and inspire.
http://www.share-international.org/

He teaches that humanity must stop worshipping competition and adopt the principle of sharing. Equitable sharing of the world's resources will in turn lead to a new age of peace, co-operation and global community.

Is Creme right? I don't know, but he makes a nice change from all these gloom and doom sayers.

Another saying which comes to my mind is: "God has no hands but our own" heard frequently in Christian circles.

I do not ask to see the distant scene, merely to follow the light and to act accordingly in the present.
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