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Forthcoming get-together and 'AGM' for 911 Truth Scotland
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Keith Mothersson
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 5:57 pm    Post subject: Forthcoming get-together and 'AGM' for 911 Truth Scotland Reply with quote

E-mail notification to follow, but this is to flag up Saturday, May 10th for a meeting of activists and interested supporters in our 911 truth network in Scotland.

it will take place in ideal premises at the Falkirk Christian Centre, where we once hosted David and Annie for an evening. In Glebe St, very near one of the Falkirk Railway stations. Start about 10.30 for 11.00, finish about 5.00?

We have a lot to talk about. Please use this forum to raise your proposals, ideas, plans for workshop(s), concerns, beefs.

We need at some point to have an 'AGM' to decide who is going to take on what responsibilities for the future. I do hope that 'new blood' will come forward, or maybe some veteran blood I foolishly alienated at one stage, sorry CB.

I will post other thoughts on another thread. This one is more practical, inviting people to come forward for and in advance of the day with your ideas, folks!

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 10:28 am    Post subject: Re: Please use this forum to raise your proposals, ideas &am Reply with quote

I would love to be able to make it but distance, no car and domestic commitments make this difficult. One thing I would hope that can be discussed in Falkirk is the topic I have flagged-up here:

http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?p=113245#113245

I strongly feel that this involves the subject of non-affiliation which we must be very clear about. No political party -even were it to agree with this Forum's purpose- should be allowed to hijack it.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 1:41 pm    Post subject: agreed Reply with quote

agreed.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Keith. But have you seen this?

http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?p=113260#113260

It's this kind of autocratic behaviour which makes me despair of the main UK Forum. Currently we in this Group seem to be in a similar position to a Holyrood Parliament on the way to a final decoupling and full independence!

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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 2:57 pm    Post subject: Agenda for our Falkirk gathering this Saturday (May 10th) Reply with quote

Sat May 10th: Scottish 911 Truth Movement gathering in Falkirk

Venue: Falkirk Christian Centre, 1 Glebe St, near Falkirk Grahamstown train station; (these are ideal premises on first floor)

Times:
meet 10.00 onwards to browse stall and for start around 10.30.

10.30: Getting to know each other/mutual introductions -
'oh let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late' (Dylan) : 911 and our lives, our relationships, our hopes and frustrations

11.30: Scottish politics and the war on terror

12.00: The 911 Truth movement at a time of change - new horizons, different strategies and priorities for outreach; how can diversity of approaches be positive, not mutually frustrating?

12.40: What actions, what resources do we need for different contexts and constituencies? Websites, leaflets, literature stalls, dvds, badges, T-shirts ....

1.15 to 1.45 Lunch - bring sandwiches, fruit, goodies to share, there will be a kitchen for making tea, etc

1.45 to 2.30 - DVD showing - one proposal is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyZU6eYkC4c , but bring allternative suggestions if you disagree

2.30 continue and review priorities for the afternoon.
e.g. Possible workshops:- additional or alternative ideas welcome:

New website(s) - forums

All Faiths for 911 Truth or All Faiths Against All Terrorism

Make Wars History

BBCwatch

3.30: Ideas for doing something at the Festival and festivals this summer/autumn:

4.15: Reports back: Review of day and commitments for future work.

close 5 to 5.20 ish

Please bring money (for buying dvds, etc and for small donations towards cost of the day, Food/juice to share, ideas, energy, goodwill, questions, hope and maybe a friend or two! )

Transport info:
From Edinburgh Waverley: trains are every half hour 9.33: arrive 10.04 Falkirk Grahamstown (very close by) ; afterwards: trains at 5.22 and 6.02 back to Edinburgh.

Bus 38 from Waterloo Pl: 9.07 arrive 10.29
return buses 5.10 or 6.01.

From Glasgow Queen St: 9.22 arrive 10.06 Falkirk Grahamstown; afterwards 5.42 arrive back 6.26.

Bus X37 from Buchanan St 8.45 arrive Falkirk bus station 10.00 (though maybe ask if you should get off earlier).
buses back at 5.15 and 5.45

From Stirling Bus station: stand 3: Bus 9.00 arrive 9.49 get off at Asda. Return 5.32 arrive 6.13.

Any queries: please phone Keith at 01738 783677 or 07815 653389

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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 3:14 pm    Post subject: deleted Reply with quote

deleted - as now reposted below
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Last edited by Keith Mothersson on Tue May 06, 2008 3:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 3:29 pm    Post subject: Bizarre Bizaar and Sharon's proposal Reply with quote

I will being several really interesting books for people to browse, and it would be great if others do too .... as well as any dvds etc to share, sell cheaply, etc ....or T-shirts .... -- you get the idea.

Plus a woman from Ayrshire writes: I run events in glasgow and Ayrshire, mainly of the live music variety. Should you need any help organising events of any kind for the movement (whether it be rally, conference or live music etc) , please don't hesitate to contact me. I will gladly help this cause.

So we need to make time to discuss this fine offer and also her idea for approaching Scottish 'Celebs' for a collective endorsement .....

Hopefully she will be with us on Saturday. Who wants to work with her on these projects?

Or is 911 just a spectator sport hobby?

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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 5:50 pm    Post subject: in reply! Reply with quote

I am that Ayrshire one! Smile

I'm really sorry that I havn't been able to come to any of the meet ups! uni is actually wrecking me just now!

I finish in 10 days time then i'll be moving house, as soon as all that is out way, I will come to a meet up and introduce myself!

i hope all the meetings are going well!

best,
Sharon
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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 11:06 am    Post subject: Re: Agenda for our Falkirk gathering this Saturday (May 10th Reply with quote

keith Mothersson wrote:

1.45 to 2.30 - DVD showing - one proposal is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyZU6eYkC4c , but bring allternative suggestions if you disagree


are you serious???????????????? of all the credible info out there this is the one film chosen????????????????? are you trying to set out to fail???

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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 11:52 am    Post subject: Re: Agenda for our Falkirk gathering this Saturday (May 10th Reply with quote

andyb wrote:
are you serious???????????????? of all the credible info out there this is the one film chosen????????????????? are you trying to set out to fail???


The video is called Morgan Reynolds w/interview by Joe Friendly so, I'd say the answer is probably yes... Rolling Eyes

With things like this and the whole truth campaign and in fact most the content of this site, it's really no wonder that the 9/11 truth movement is getting nowhere fast in the UK is it... Rolling Eyes

http://911disinformation.com/#BeamWeaponsAnchor

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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 1:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Agenda for our Falkirk gathering this Saturday (May 10th Reply with quote

chrisc wrote:
With things like this and the whole truth campaign and in fact most the content of this site, it's really no wonder that the 9/11 truth movement is getting nowhere fast in the UK is it... Rolling Eyes

http://911disinformation.com/#BeamWeaponsAnchor


Indeed. Did you know Mr Mothersson is a disinfo fanboy Chris? Loves it he does. See here

keith Mothersson wrote:
1.45 to 2.30 - DVD showing


Probably not worth watching the atrocious Reynolds vid though simply as it's 58 minutes long and only 45 minutes have been allotted to the DVD viewing.

Architect Richard Gage's ' How the Towers Fell - Part I: "WTC Building #7 A controlled demolition?" (see the left side of ae911truth.org) has a running time of 45 minutes and might fit in nicely however.

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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 1:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Agenda for our Falkirk gathering this Saturday (May 10th Reply with quote

gareth wrote:
Did you know Mr Mothersson is a disinfo fanboy Chris? Loves it he does. See here


Good grief Shocked

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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah I see it now.

The fact that the truth about what happened on 911 has been ignored by those that would render it valuable and who would otherwise have provoked a massive change, is because of Morgan Reynolds ?

Am I somewhere near your message ?

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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 8:17 pm    Post subject: Morgan Reynolds Reply with quote

Mark Gobell wrote:
The fact that the truth about what happened on 911 has been ignored by those that would render it valuable and who would otherwise have provoked a massive change, is because of Morgan Reynolds ?

Am I somewhere near your message ?


Hmm, well he is clearly part of the problem with the no-planes and DEW lunacy... Rolling Eyes

http://911disinformation.com/#BeamWeaponsAnchor

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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And you are part of the solution ?
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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 2:13 pm    Post subject: Sorry about this everyone Reply with quote

A visit from the London Stalinist Thought police I see.

Well, surprise, surprise, if someone coming to the meeting has a better idea we can discuss which dvd to watch. (as I suggested to people)

But we in Scotland can do without Gareth and Andy poking their nose in, thank you.

And please apologise both of you or else I will ask the three Scottish moderators to consider colouring your interventions in RED with an apology for your arrogant rudeness.

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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 3:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Sorry about this everyone Reply with quote

keith Mothersson wrote:
A visit from the London Stalinist Thought police I see.
...we in Scotland can do without Gareth and Andy poking their nose in, thank you.


Keith,

I suggest you calm down and take a step back.

Are you closing the meeting off to those who disagree with you???
Doesn't sound the wisest move you've ever made.

Essentially you've failed to convince hardly anyone in the movement bout the more controversial theories so they are quite rightly questioning the wisdom of going with these largely unconvincing videos.

If they're not allowed to raise these legitimate concerns and questions you are the problem not them.

And.... you become the 'thought police' not them.

And.... people will be bound to question your motives.

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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Are you closing the meeting off to those who disagree with you???
Doesn't sound the wisest move you've ever made.


what a bloody stupid supposition. People who are aversive to open discussion should stay away, but I have no problem with someone who gives reasons for questioning anything in any dvd, or who proposes a different dvd.

I have a better idea of who will be coming than you have. Those who will be coming probably had dvds from me two years ago or one year ago, featuring a two hour talk from Stevn Jones, and talks by DRG featuring 'air defense stand-down's and 'hijackers' .....

But truth is a process and so long as we treat each other with respect, as I did in both a) giving the URL of the dvd showing and b) emphasising that it was a suggestion/proposal which others could counter-propose ,

then it is legitimate for me and Paul to propose that the assembled few (under 15 probably) might like to look into this New Horizon stuff ....

There will also be a copy of The 9/11 Conspiracy - the Scamming of America edited by James H FETZER AND WITH CONTRIBUTIONS FROM JUDY WOOD AND MORGAN REYNOLDS on the table for people to browse at - if that is alright with you Tony, and so long as Messrs Gareth and Baker don't send a snatch squad to lock it up away from vulnerable eyes .... Some Change they ....

I'm 60 years old and I have been turning people on the 911 truth for years, and have heard all the arguments against a) the truth of the Wood/Reynolds/videofakery position and b) the tactical arguments about when to lead with what arguments [Speed of WTC destructions is always the first port of call, it is so open and shut; then maybe the financial scams, or else the total lack of reliable evidence (pace Henshall) that there were any muscle men or ringleader hi-jackers on board, coupled with clear proof of planting of evidence - including the wrong wheels turning up under scaffolding next to two separate fascist columns in Manhattan) ....

so I don't need any further advice from non-Scots-residents on this particular thread, and do you know what, the Scots who will be coming can well represent their own views, look with an open mind or argue with an open mind or propose something different to watch .... imagine that! - without the anxious superintendence of certain people who should apologise for gross arrogance barging in like that and amusing themselves by publicly abusing to each other one of the hardest working colleagues in the 911 truth movement, who has spent a lot of money on passing out dvds and pamphlets, etc ... is that the sort of behaviour the London group would encourage? or We are change? or that Gareth does with his MPH hat on?

It isn't as if I and Paul haven't been outfront with the Scottish network since starting to tune in to the new Horizons - we both have, and though one or two haven't agreed, I can't recall anyone who has wanted off the mailing list because of these terrible heresies ...

see for example Newsletters here:
http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?t=13890

http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?t=13797

Truth is a process and you get nowhere gratuitously abusing people, Gareth, nor shadowing the post of what this deviant Mothersson might be sharing with others in Scotland - how would you like it if I were to shadow every post you and Andy make and beef about your racism in still accepting the Hijacker story (if you do) ....

I mean just because there is no proof Oswald killed Kennedy, doesn't mean his majic bullet didn't do the trick; and just because there is no proof that the 19 Arabs were anywhere near 'the planes' that day , doesn't prove they weren't, along with grannie ... I mean the rest of what the media and intel services are telling us is so reliable like about the kerosene fires melting the steel framed buildings, isn't it, right .....

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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have done great work Keith.

Re-reading this thread more thoroughly Gareth's wording is unnecessary, mean and provocative. Especially since you are putting your time and effort into organising this.

Calling fellow campaigners that have valid differences of opinion 'thought police' does not help the wider cause though.

It would be a lot better all round were you to calmly explain your point of view.

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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I second that Tony. My own experience of Gareth is someone who shuts down debate, which is valid in terms of discussing these issues with the public but invalid when discussions take place within an informed environment such as this one. Gareth's actions were the primary reason why i walked away from WAC UK. He is young so maybe in time he will learn that a lot of his barbed comments are projections of his own making. Useful Idiot or MI5, take your pick. Gareth accusing Keith of being "thought police" is very rich. He really is best ignored.
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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tomcatma wrote:
I second that Tony. My own experience of Gareth is someone who shuts down debate, which is valid in terms of discussing these issues with the public but invalid when discussions take place within an informed environment such as this one. Gareth's actions were the primary reason why i walked away from WAC UK. He is young so maybe in time he will learn that a lot of his barbed comments are projections of his own making. Useful Idiot or MI5, take your pick. Gareth accusing Keith of being "thought police" is very rich. He really is best ignored.


I looking for an honest word in the above post... nope, still can't find it...

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 7:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

More than happy to meet with you Stefan to discuss what went down for me in WAC. I know my conflict with you was left unresolved so it maybe worthwhile to discuss that too. Let me know either way via this forum and I will ring you.
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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

keith Mothersson wrote:

then it is legitimate for me and Paul to propose that the assembled few (under 15 probably) might like to look into this New Horizon stuff ....

There will also be a copy of The 9/11 Conspiracy - the Scamming of America edited by James H FETZER AND WITH CONTRIBUTIONS FROM JUDY WOOD AND MORGAN REYNOLDS on the table for people to browse at - if that is alright with you Tony, and so long as Messrs Gareth and Baker don't send a snatch squad to lock it up away from vulnerable eyes .... Some Change they ....
.


Keith, to call me a racist is slanderous. I don't know what happened on 9/11 and that is why I'm campaigning for a new investigation. You say with certainty there were no hijackers but this is speculation. Stick to facts and we might get somewhere.

You say you've been doing this years yet expect under 15 people to show up, perhaps time for a change in tactics??

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tomcatma wrote:
More than happy to meet with you Stefan to discuss what went down for me in WAC. I know my conflict with you was left unresolved so it maybe worthwhile to discuss that too. Let me know either way via this forum and I will ring you.


Tom,
Sorry for the previous post; airing dirty laundry in public isn't good. I just don't feel the comments you made about G are fair, especially "MI5 or useful idiot" and neither do I think summarising the various left-right-and-centre conflicts you had with multiple members of the group as being Gareths fault. He wasn't the constant factor in that series of episodes.

There's no serious beef between us Tom, you know that, just please don't slag off my friends online and expect me to hold my composure, you know I'm too emotional for that...

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello andyb

You state....

"Keith, to call me a racist is slanderous. I don't know what happened on 9/11 and that is why I'm campaigning for a new investigation. You say with certainty there were no hijackers but this is speculation. Stick to facts and we might get somewhere."

Could you provide evidence for hijackers please.....

Any Evidence for Hijackers.?

Quote:
"That, for instance, the 9/11 hijackers were closely watched and protected in the US by covert guardian angels."

What hijackers? There were hijackers on the planes on 9/11? How do you know?

Because Barbara Olsen said so, during her impossible cellphone call to her husband?

Because the FBI found "Atta's suitcase" that incredibly didn't get transferred onto the plane, but that contained a treasure-trove of incriminating 'evidence', including a suicide note (which he intended to take with him on the plane)?

Because of the miraculous passport of Sattam al-Suqami, found slightly scorched a few blocks away from the WTC -- how did it survive the fires?

Because of the passenger lists that were first released by the airlines, and then withdrawn and classified, which contained none of the "hijackers'" names, nor even any passengers with Arabic names?

Were any of the 'hijackers' filmed getting on any of the planes? Did I miss that?

If there's ever been ANY credible evidence that there were hijackers on those planes -- meaning evidence that even passes the laugh test -- I've never heard of it.

If you have, man I'd love to know about that.

Until then... What hijackers?

Blackbear..........The new 9/11 forum.....stefan proposes no religious conspiracy theories......

or does the above only apply to people who follow judaism .......
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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blackbear,
What Andy is saying I agree with - he is not saying there were highjackers, he is saying no evidence of hijackers does not equal proof of no highjackers - he is simply making a very common sense plea that we not speculate.

As for your comment which seemed pointed at me - I can't unravel it sorry. What do you mean exactly?

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blackbear,

All I'm saying is that without speculating i don't know. i do know that the 'hijackers'(please note the inverted commas) had gone to flying school. let's just stick to what we know and can back up with solid evidence. there's so much of it we don'y need to speculate is all I'm saying.

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hello stefan.....

An important tenet of the "official conspiract theory" is 19 arab/muslim hijackers are to blame for 3000 deaths that day.

Where is the evidence for that.?

andyb...states....

"You say with certainty there were no hijackers but this is speculation"

It is pure speculation by andyb that there was 19 muslim hijackers that day. He might naively be swallowing this aspect of the official story.

andyb......states.... stick to the facts...

OK.....show the facts that prove 19 muslim hijackers were involved.....

Truth Action....recommends.....no jewish conspiracy theories..
You improve that by saying.....no religious conspiracy theories...

This is not meant to be pointed at you. It was "pointed" at andyb.....

The belief in 19 muslim hijackers could well be interpreted as a conspiracy theory against muslims. Look to Afghanistan + the war against muslims in Iraq, etc. [/b]

It is up to andyb to reply.

Take care + good luck.......

blackbear.....
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Stefan
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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blackbear,
I'm sure Andy will reply, but I have a few things to say myself.

First of all I want to clarify that I was refering to the "truth seeking" side of 9/11 truth - who place finidng out what happened above and beyound everything else as "religious" in a sense in their motivation. My point was that truth action is about campaigning and enabling campaigning - the priority is to wake people up and get them asking their own questions and not zealously trying to force your own answers on them.

Let me state also that whether or not highjackers were involved they would not be responsible for 3000 lives - the people who blew the buildings up would be.

Let me ask you this - who was responsible for the 93 bombing - the FBI who facilitated the attack, the CIA who supplied the bomb making materials, both for sitting back and letting the attack happen - or the patsies - ACTUAL - Islamists who believed they were working alone?

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xmasdale
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Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1959
Location: South London

PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always get upset when my comrades start quarreling with each other, particularly when they do it in public.

I suggest the following principles would be good to adhere to.

1. If you have a criticism of a fellow campaigner take the issue up with them personally in the first instance.

2. If that doesn't get anywhere and if some principle affecting the campaign is involved, open the debate to others, via e-mail - not on this forum which merely washes our dirty linen in public.

3. Don't jump to conclusions about the actions of others. If you are going to criticise them, be very sure of your facts before making allegations.

4. Always be prepared to apologise for hurt caused

5. Try to understand where the other person is coming from. (they are probably as sincere as you are)

---------------------------------------------

On the question of attitudes towards what really happened on Sept 11 2001.

1. Everyone should feel free to associate with anyone they want, any theory they want and any person they want.

2. Those who are presenting a case to the public should avoid speculation about what really happened, but should use well tried and tested questions and anomalies in the official conspiracy theory.

3. Those who want to advance in public theories as to what happened, should make clear that they are doing this in an individual capacity and not on behalf of the British 9/11 Truth Campaign.

4. Treat your comrades as you would like to be treated by them.

5. Never publicly imply that one of your comrades is a shill or an agent. (I have never known any one able to prove such an accusation)

Maybe others can add some good principles which I have forgotten.

Best

Noel

------------------------------------

Our life is love, and peace, and tenderness; and bearing one with another, and forgiving one another, and not laying accusations one against another; but praying one for another, and helping one another up with a tender hand.

Isaac Penington, 1667 (mystic and Quaker)
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