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7/7. The Ripple Effect - a documentary by Muad'Dib
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

karlos wrote:
GodSaveTheTeam wrote:
Anyone know where I can find the 'panorama:london under attack' show that is featured in this film?

We have tried, the BBC have deleted it.
Although somebody must have archived it somewhere.

Mark - thanks for posting the company stuff up.
I think it is pretty obvious these are Mossad controlled companies but more important is the fact that at each end of the chain Verint, Fortress GB and ICTS control the security, cctv, etc. Making this an inhouse deal.
People like Peter Power may have been outsiders employed to carry out the drills that occured at the same time as the bombs. Power being an ex Met officer would provide legitimate cover - meaning he would stand as a barrier between his 'clients' and the police investigating the bombings.
By hiring an insider they effectively blocked questions being asked about them.[/b]


Guilliani was in London on the day with Netanyahu.
Guillani it was openly announced yesterday on Ch 4 I think had the control and command centre of rescue services in WTC7. The building that was brought down.

So what was he doing in London if not overseeing the 'terror events'?

The London bus could have been the mobile command centre of 7/7. Once the tube bombs had gone off and everything had gone to plan, the bus was detonated.

Who is Guillani?

Quote:
Giuliani’s Closet
Posted by Justin Raimondo on March 27, 2007

A Naughty Naughty Boy

Rudy Giuliani’s closet is filled to overflowing, and its
contents are dropping out all over just as he ratchets up his
presidential bid. And there’s a lot more than bones in those
dark recesses: go here for the full (450 pages!) story, but
I’ll give you the short (and spicy) version:

Marries His Cousin

It’s all about the “weirdness factor,” as a secret study done
by the Giuliani election team and leaked to the “Smoking Gun”
website puts it. There’s the matter of his first marriage, to
his cousin, Regina Peruggi: Rudy claims that for 14 years he
didn’t know that she was a twig on his very own family tree,
but if you buy that, you’re no doubt still waiting for those
“weapons of mass destruction” to be unearthed in Iraq any day
now.

Second Wife

Although he doesn’t say exactly when he took the trouble to
investigate his family genealogy more closely, Rudy started
seeing Donna Hanover in 1982: his marriage to Peruggi wasn’t
annulled by the Church until the tail end of ’83. This
particular corner of Giuliani’s closet is a particularly dank
and cobwebby realm, best not looked at too closely. As the
secret study put it, the matter of his first marriage “has
been raised in the media as an extremely bizarre event.” And
we’re talking about his home town media: just wait until the
evangelicals in the outbacks get the lowdown on what has
charitably been described as Rudy’s “chaotic” personal life,
which is racy even for cosmopolitan New York: this was
reportedly the real reason he backed down from challenging
Hillary Clinton in the Senate race. The Giuliani dossier goes
on to bluntly assess the candidate’s vulnerabilities:

Neocons Are Used To Intermarriage

“In reviewing the news stories describing this event and
others in his private life, there are numerous inconsistencies
and questionable circumstances about how long the two were
married, whether Giuliani knew he was marrying his second
cousin, whether he dated other women while still married.”

None of this matters, of course, to the neocons who seem to
have united around Giuliani: indeed, they rather prefer it, I
think, because it underscores their elitism, their sense of
themselves as philosopher-kings exempt from the myths that
dominate the lives of ordinary men and women. There is one
truth for the elites, and another one for the masses. If
you’re a Straussian, this isn’t monstrous hypocrisy: it’s the
natural order of things.

The Crusader

Ah, but don’t worry, the anointed one will be able to
bamboozle the bourgeoisie on account of his ascension into the
mythic iconography of 9/11, and his reputation as America’s
Mayor and his hardline neoconservative foreign policy views:
according to CBS News, Rudy “perhaps more than any other
candidate comes closest to holding neoconservative views on
foreign policy.” Rudy will come packaged as the uber-Bush, a
more decisive and even ruthless leader who will complete the
neoconservative revolution by launching simultaneous invasions
of all Muslim countries, and with Russia thrown into the
bargain for good measure. This is to be followed very shortly
by the ditching of the Constitution, and, presumably, the End
of History.

Or, at least, the end of our old republic, and the beginning
of the age of the American Caesars. Let a descendant of the
ancient Romans reclaim the imperial purple – yes, life is full
of little ironies, and mostly they are unpleasant surprises.

The neocon conception of American foreign policy as seeking
out “benevolent global hegemony” is perfectly suited to Rudy’s
imperial persona. His supposed strengths as the “national
security” candidate are what, one supposes, the neocons regard
as their trump card: i.e., a continuation of our crazed
foreign policy which is opposed by more than two thirds of the
American people.

This, however, is what counts to the ghoulish coalition that
currently controls the GOP: Upper West Side neocons, and born-
again backwoods folk quite inured to the idea of kissin’
cousins. Add to this the rising generation of Ann Coulter fans
who are ready for a new Lider Maximo, and we have Bushism
without Bush, a dissolute prince of the city whose inner
demons are to be enacted on the world stage.

American Caligula

If we are going to compare American Presidents to Roman
emperors – a practice, I fear, bound to become customary in
the annals of future history tomes – a President Giuliani
would probably turn into an American Caligula, who, in a
gesture of contempt for the surviving institutions of the old
Roman republic, appointed his horse proconsul. Bernard Kerik,
Rudy’s former close associate and his pick for Homeland
Security chief, is probably comparable to that, although I
wouldn’t want to insult horses, but you get the idea if you
follow the links.

Bernie Kerik

What interests me about Kerik, however, isn’t the alleged
organized crime connections, or even his typically New Yawkish
grabbiness and gaudiness, his persona as a “character” – the
“Mayhem Magnet” --but his briefly held position as “interim”
minister of the interior in newly-conquered Iraq. Here we had
just subjugated the country, and the first wave of neocon-
connected appointees were flown over there, including Kerik –
who, as unofficial head of the thuggery department, set up the
Iraqi national police. Here’s a clip from his interview with
the Lehr News Hour that gives us the flavor of his methods and
practices

“If you pick the right leaders and you place them in the right
positions, let them do their job and that's sort of what's
going on in the police now. We appointed a senior deputy
minister, we appointed the chiefs in Baghdad throughout the
rest of the country. We have to make sure that we keep track
of them, monitor them, but let them do their job, let them
pick the right people; then the job gets done.”

Kerik Trainees

These “police” are now functioning as death squads, executing
and ethnically cleansing Sunnis from Baghdad and environs:
they have already accomplished this in the largely Shi’ite
south. The job is indeed getting done.

If and when Rudy takes the oath of office, and swears to
uphold the Constitution, there will be many more Keriks to
come. Believe you me, it isn’t going to be pretty. About as
pretty as Rudy in drag.

Not that there’s anything wrong with drag queens, provided
they’re either entertaining or convincing. I once saw a group
of them standing on a Jalan Sultan Ismail in Kuala Lumpur, on
Christmas eve: they seemed like young and very girlish elves,
so small and willowy were they, calling out in their singsong
voices. More feminine than your average American woman, in any
case: exclaiming on their beauty, I was corrected by my young,
uh, guide, who assured me that these were “lady-boys.”
(Another of life’s little ironies: there are more lady-boys on
Jalan Sultan Ismail, a busy thoroughfare in a supposedly
Islamic country, than there ever were on San Francisco’s
Castro Street. )

I don’t care one whit about Giuliani’s private life, although
I have a hard time believing the evangelicals are quite ready
for the rutting Rudy. He is, after all, an Italian male, with
certain impulses wired into his brain, particularly that part
of it that rules the sexual imagination. I say, more power to
him in that department – life, as the Italians know, is to be
enjoyed, rather than endured. But what we shouldn’t have to
endure is a Giuliani presidency, which would be a disaster in
both the foreign policy and civil liberties departments. As
far as the latter is concerned, if he treats the Constitution
like he treated the New York City Charter, we are in for a
hard time. Regarding the latter, I’ll just cite his stated
views:

“We've got to start getting beyond Iraq. We've got to be
thinking about Iran. We have to think about Syria. We have to
be thinking about Pakistan and Afghanistan and making sure
that the transition in Afghanistan goes correctly. We have to
be ready for the fact that, whatever happens in Iraq, success
or failure — success will help us in the War on Terror.
Failure will hurt us. But the war is still going to go on.
They're still going to want to come here and kill us.”

It wasn’t Iraqis who attacked us on 9/11, and yet Giuliani
insists on seeing everything through the prism of 9/11 – and
so, in his world, we don’t need to inquire too closely into
who “they” are. In this Orwellian age, the enemy is bound to
change, anyway, at any particular moment: you’ll recall that,
yesterday, the enemy was the Ba’athist “dead-enders,” and
their Sunni supporters. Today it is renegade Shi’ites, like
the Mahdi Army, and the very “police” force-death squads that
Giuliani’s buddy Kerik set up. A more classic example of
“blowback,” as the CIA types call it, would be hard to
imagine. And we’ll be getting plenty of blowback from the
foreign policy of the Giuliani administration, promising to be
even more reckless (if that’s imaginable) than Bush’s – and
that’s my real objection to the first drag queen in the White
House.

http://judicial-inc.biz/giuliani.htm
--
A government, of, by, and, for: Rich, Elite, Freemasons.But
all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light:
for whatsoever doth make manifest is light.The light shineth
in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.The light of
the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy
whole body shall be full of light. But if thine eye be evil,
thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the
light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!
Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ
shall give thee light.For my yoke is easy, and my burden is
light.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New York firefighters condemn Giuliani for sending firefighters into the Twin Towers certainly to their death.

Illuminating is that his right hand man had mob ties, is as bent as a 50p piece, he was nominated to be head of Homeland Security by Guiliani himself and that he was in London on 7/7.

What are the chances in that?

What were his movements on the day?

http://www.pressbox.co.uk/detailed/Government/Imperato_Calls_it_Again_ Rudy_Giuliani_New_York_Mafia_Conspiracy_152608.html
Quote:
“It doesn’t surprise me,” stated Imperato upon learning of the recent FBI report, “Rudy Giuliani ran around New York City bragging about how he shut down the mafia. Instead of being a professional he tried to make himself a celebrity. I’m sure that people didn’t take to kindly to Mr. Giuliani’s ego trip.”

Imperato also stated that he feels that that this is only the beginning of Rudy Giuliani “discoveries”.

“Rudy Giuliani has paraded around New York City as some sort of hero for far too long now. I would not be surprised if new discoveries were to come out about Mr. Giuliani’s business dealings and personal life that would cause America’s to view him in a different way,” stated Imperato.

This is not the first time that Rudy Giuliani’s name has been brought up in connection with the mafia.

Back in July, in front in Grand Jury, former New York Mayor, Rudolph Giuliani testified that it was a "mistake" to recommend his former Police Chief Bernard Kerik to the post of Secretary of Homeland Security.

Kerik, who parlayed his 9/11 fame along with Giuliani into millions through the Giuliani Partners, is now sure to receive federal felony charges from tax evasion, to filing false information with the government. In addition, it has come out that Bernard Kerik has open mob ties.

In response to Kerik's open mob ties, Giuliani pointed to his history as New York mayor of virtually eliminating the mafia and organized crime from New York City.

“I find it interesting that Mr. Giuliani refers to his record as to why people should support him.”
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madrid twinned with New York Ghouliani close collaborator with this city.
Coincidence or organisation?

http://www.nyc.gov/html/rwg/mcp/html/scp/scpmadrid.html

Expressions of Support to New York City:

*
... sincere condolences ... indignation against these terrorist attacks ... the City of Madrid can help in any way ...

PRELIMINARY FACTS

Year Established: 1982

Mayor of New York City: Rudolph W. Giuliani

Mayor of Madrid: José María Álvarez del Manzano

President, The Sister City Program
of the City of New York, Inc.: Theresa E. Behrendt

Relationship Type: Official Sister City Partnership

Committee Chair, New York City:
Ambassador Richard N. Gardner

Program Liaison, New York City:
Henrietta Lyle, Executive Director,
The Sister City Program of the City of New York, Inc.

Program Coordinator, New York City:
Martha Wittosch, The Sister City Program
of the City of New York, Inc.

If anyone goes into the history of ex-Ambassador Gardner he was also Ambassador in Italy during the so-called Red Brigades terrorist group and the murder of the Prime Minister then, as well as being a member of the Trilateral Commision.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/rwg/mcp/html/scp/scpmadridbios.html

So we have two or three coincidences here.
Can anyone spot them?
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

karlos wrote:
GodSaveTheTeam wrote:
Anyone know where I can find the 'panorama:london under attack' show that is featured in this film?

We have tried, the BBC have deleted it.

No they haven't. Making even just sections of Panorama programmes routinely available online did not start until 2005; for 2004 only two programmes have extracts, and only one is available in its entirety. London Under Attack is only one out of the other 27 programmes, although unlike some of them, it has a transcript available.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As we were told during the Jane Standley scandal. The BBC are required as part of their charter to maintain an archive of all their broadcasts, including live and recorded.
Clearly the Panorama was not live so it must be made available.

However, the other interesting and connected programme was called SPY a gameshow type of programme where people were asked to perform tasks as trainee MI5 agents.
Like going into a WHSmith and arguing over a 9v battery.

Clearly the maker of the film had access to BBC footage and ITN footage.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

karlos wrote:
As we were told during the Jane Standley scandal. The BBC are required as part of their charter to maintain an archive of all their broadcasts, including live and recorded.
Clearly the Panorama was not live so it must be made available.

The requirement for the BBC to retain copies of all broadcasts only came in with the 2006 Charter (it's actually defined in the Agreement), and even then it can dispose of programmes it does not wish to retain, as long as they offer them to other archives/collections first (effectively this is the BFI/NFA). As to public access, the Agreement states that archiving arrangements:
Quote:
...must give the public reasonable opportunities to visit the archives and view or listen to material kept there, with or without charge (as the Executive Board thinks fit).

Note that the minimum requirement is that people should be able to view material at the archive itself, possibly subject to a charge. There is, then, no requirement to make all archives programmes available online, and the very fact that only a relatively tiny percentage have been reflects this.
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guzman
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Staraker wrote:
karlos wrote:
As we were told during the Jane Standley scandal. The BBC are required as part of their charter to maintain an archive of all their broadcasts, including live and recorded.
Clearly the Panorama was not live so it must be made available.

The requirement for the BBC to retain copies of all broadcasts only came in with the 2006 Charter (it's actually defined in the Agreement), and even then it can dispose of programmes it does not wish to retain, as long as they offer them to other archives/collections first (effectively this is the BFI/NFA). As to public access, the Agreement states that archiving arrangements:
Quote:
...must give the public reasonable opportunities to visit the archives and view or listen to material kept there, with or without charge (as the Executive Board thinks fit).

Note that the minimum requirement is that people should be able to view material at the archive itself, possibly subject to a charge. There is, then, no requirement to make all archives programmes available online, and the very fact that only a relatively tiny percentage have been reflects this.


The requirement to keep or freely donate all copies of BBC broadcasts dates at least as far back as the 1996 agreement.

Quote:
11. ARCHIVES
11.1 The Corporation shall at its own expense make appropriate arrangements to establish and maintain (or to procure that a designated body establish and maintain) to commonly accepted standards an archive or archives of films, sound recordings and other recorded and printed matter which is representative of the sound and television programmes and films broadcast or transmitted by the Corporation. The Corporation shall make reasonable arrangements, itself or with such body or bodies as it chooses, for public access to its sound, television or film archives with or without charge as the Corporation thinks fit.

11.2 Prior to and in making such arrangements the Corporation shall consult such designated bodies as are engaged in the maintenance of sound, television and film archives as it considers appropriate.

11.3 The Corporation shall not sell, destroy or otherwise dispose of any broadcast or transmitted material which it decides not to include in any archive established pursuant to subclause without first offering such material free of charge to an appropriate designated body or bodies engaged in the maintenance of sound, television and film archives and transferring such material to such designated body or bodies which accept such offer as the Corporation may think fit.

BBC Agreement (pdf)
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It takes I hour 15 minutes to get from King's Cross to Canary Wharf by bus, taking the 30 then changing onto the 277, so it might just be feasible. Bit of a rush, but the event is not ruled out by that journey time.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 1:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seeking to get a Muad'Dib showing and presentation soon
You can endlessly debate the finer points

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Seeking to get a Muad'Dib showing and presentation soon


an excellent idea
this is the best 7/7 docu so far and the production quality is excellent
i sent an email to the contact on his website but never got a response, has anyone managed to converse with the filmaker?
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

karlos wrote:
Quote:
Seeking to get a Muad'Dib showing and presentation soon


an excellent idea
this is the best 7/7 docu so far and the production quality is excellent
i sent an email to the contact on his website but never got a response, has anyone managed to converse with the filmaker?


I've had quite an extensive interchange with Muad. He seems a great guy.
Haven't quite managed to get him to agree to a public presentation in a pertinent place, but am hopeful

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He says on his site that he wants as many people to copy and distribute it as possible.
We could have a series of screenings followed by question and answer sessions.
He does not have to do this in person there are many of us who could do this.

If you are conversing with him, is there any comment from him about ICTS and Fotress GB both of which are based in Tavistock square?

Also the disappearing bus driver.

He could always recut the video slightly to take into account a few more issues. Perhaps.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
is there any comment from him about ICTS and Fotress GB both of which are based in Tavistock square?

Also the disappearing bus driver.

Please clarify
ps I dont want to be a conduit. I'll try to arrange a direct contact via pm if you want
Perhaps his email is overloaded

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes direct contact would be useful
thanks
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:49 pm    Post subject: Panorama documentary from 7/7 Ripple Effect in full Reply with quote

This Panorama show is featured in the 7/7 Ripple Effect documentary, please copy the entire link to your internet browser and then right click and 'save target as' to your hard drive in order to view the entire shocking 2004 BBC documentary on your own PC...

http://files.100777.com/BBC%20Panorama%2016%20May%202004%20-%20London% 20Under%20Attack%5B%20incomplete%2088%20percent%5D/


Any problems at all PM us please, we have downloaded this ourselves with no problems and are shocked by the evidence....

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Last edited by GodSaveTheTeam on Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:04 am; edited 3 times in total
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 8:10 pm    Post subject: what? Reply with quote

OK I read the txt file. tx.

cheers Al..
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muad lives in Ireland, Eire, I believe since that's where his dvd came from. That means realistically if we wanted to present him it would be as a tour. As he says he is shy and reticent , so maybe we should do the presentation ourselves
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

karlos wrote:


Also the disappearing bus driver.



From MD
Quote:
Disappearing bus driver? Do you mean the regular driver, so that the
mind-controlled substitute (according to AJ) could take the bus instead? Has the
missing driver reappeared?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re Canary Wharf, I did quite a bit of digging at the time (in july 2005) to try and find any corroborating evidence/witnesses for the report. I found one reference (that I believe prole refers to) to an anonymous reference on a discussion board. When I emailed them I received no reply. Beyond that nothing, nada. Now a smoking gun such as this would blow J7 right open but I could find no witnesses or chatter of any kind, so I'm inclined to agree with Staraker on this. As for the 4 being part of the Peter Power exercise, do we have anything to say that the exercise was anything other than what Peter Power says ie a desk based exercise.

There are loads of holes and questions in the official narrative but canary wharf appears like a deadend to me. If you could find corroboration or a police whistleblower that would change things but ....


Last edited by ian neal on Fri Nov 23, 2007 9:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a toughie for sure.

Much like the "early reports of a cruise missile launched from a ship" on 911.

I know I heard it.

Can't find it though.

Makes you wonder where the subs get their copy from doesn't it?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ian - the report about the Canary Wharf shootings appeared in the New Zealand press, the Canadian press and on UK tv news.
Admitedly it only appeared once but so did most of the other 'evidence'
so it is as reliable as any other news coverage of the day.

The fact that it goes against the official stoy is probably why it has been since suppresed.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

karlos wrote:
Ian - the report about the Canary Wharf shootings appeared in the New Zealand press, the Canadian press and on UK TV news.
Admitedly it only appeared once....


Not difficult to kill these stories within the UK using official denials, as with the Iraq war WMD.

karlos wrote:
....but so did most of the other 'evidence'
so it is as reliable as any other news coverage of the day.

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www.l911t.com
www.v911t.org
www.thisweek.org.uk
www.abolishwar.org.uk
www.elementary.org.uk
www.radio4all.net/index.php/contributor/2149
http://utangente.free.fr/2003/media2003.pdf
"The maintenance of secrets acts like a psychic poison which alienates the possessor from the community" Carl Jung
https://37.220.108.147/members/www.bilderberg.org/phpBB2/
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rodin
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ian neal wrote:
Re Canary Wharf, I did quite a bit of digging at the time (in july 2005) to try and find any corroborating evidence/witnesses for the report. I found one reference (that I believe prole refers to) to an anonymous reference on a discussion board. When I emailed them I received no reply. Beyond that nothing, nada. Now a smoking gun such as this would blow J7 right open but I could find no witnesses or chatter of any kind, so I'm inclined to agree with Staraker on this. As for the 4 being part of the Peter Power exercise, do we have anything to say that the exercise was anything other than what Peter Power says ie a desk based exercise.

There are loads of holes and questions in the official narrative but canary wharf appears like a deadend to me. If you could find corroboration or a police whistleblower that would change things but ....


How would a 'desk based' exercise have to go 'from slow time to quick time' thinking if it was not directly involved with the tube itself?

Power warned us. He knew he would only have a day before his family wwre threatened if he did not switch to shoring up the OTC. 1000+ people is Mossad's Verint

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paul wright
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

These are the two small sources used by Muad
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/2/story.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10334992
and
http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0200southlondonheadlines  /tm_objectid=15716646%26method=full%26siteid=50100-name_page.html

I'd pretty much agree with Rodin on the 'slow time to quick time' comment and the source
It doesn't matter whether there were an actual 1000+ or a paper 1000+ involved as long as the 4 guys believed the story
Though obviously there were many more than those 4 , and more witting operatives out in the field

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rodin
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did not the Gov refer to numerous witness statements from people who had seen the bombers on the train that never was?

PS

Is Bridget Dunne of J7 related to Fintan of Zionist Gatekeeper fame?

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rodin
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't see how the bombers got to Canary Wharf in the timeframe nor that they would aim for Independent offices. IMO they would be running from, not to.
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Nick Cooper
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rodin wrote:
ian neal wrote:
Re Canary Wharf, I did quite a bit of digging at the time (in july 2005) to try and find any corroborating evidence/witnesses for the report. I found one reference (that I believe prole refers to) to an anonymous reference on a discussion board. When I emailed them I received no reply. Beyond that nothing, nada. Now a smoking gun such as this would blow J7 right open but I could find no witnesses or chatter of any kind, so I'm inclined to agree with Staraker on this. As for the 4 being part of the Peter Power exercise, do we have anything to say that the exercise was anything other than what Peter Power says ie a desk based exercise.

There are loads of holes and questions in the official narrative but canary wharf appears like a deadend to me. If you could find corroboration or a police whistleblower that would change things but ....


How would a 'desk based' exercise have to go 'from slow time to quick time' thinking if it was not directly involved with the tube itself?

Are you serious? The events of 7/7 disrupted the workings of many companies not "directly involved". "Business continuity" - which is what Visor does - is all about maintaining a given organisation's continued operations in the event of both direct or indirect disruption. 7/7 will have prompted many organisations - both within central London and outside - to initiate their own emergency plans, the first steps of which would be to gather those persons designated a role in those circumstances. In the case of the Visor client, this would have been exactly those people already taking part in their exercise, hence they would have had to go from dealing with a hypothetical scenario to a real one.
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karlos
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My theory is this:
The four patsies were hired to take part as actors in the drills.
You cannot have a drill without carrying out the exercise in person.
EG: everytime we have a fire drill at our place of work do we not have to exit the building and stand outside for a few minutes?

The head office for Tube Lines Ltd is in Canary Wharf
The head office for ICTS and Fortress GB is Tavistock Square
Verint are subcontractors for Metronet and Tube Lines Ltd as are ICTS

So it is highly plausible that the 4 were heading back to base or heading to Canary Wharf to carry out the exercise.
We know after all that the 4 were nowhere near the bombed trains.
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Nick Cooper
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

karlos wrote:
My theory is this:
The four patsies were hired to take part as actors in the drills.
You cannot have a drill without carrying out the exercise in person.
EG: everytime we have a fire drill at our place of work do we not have to exit the building and stand outside for a few minutes?

The premise of your "theory" is completely false, because all the circumstantial evidence suggests that what Visor were doing that day was neither as simple as a fire drill, nor as complex as what you continue to maintain what you think it was. Do you actually look at the links I provided in the Peter Powers spotted" thread? For example:
Quote:
Level 1 - Business Continuity Training

Advanced training on how to deal with any corporate emergency will be given by a UK expert on Crisis and Business Continuity Management so your team can be prepared and familiar with how to make quick decisions on issues such as locating or relocating staff, reassuring stakeholders and keeping key revenue streams working. Just as important, all of your key communication needs can be pre-configured so anyone calling your organisation will get a seamless response.

Included in the core product will be:
* 2 hour single period session to your Crisis Management Team, including their alternates in one of our CMT rooms that you would actually use in a crisis
* Understanding crises in general. How they start and what you can do to minimise the impact
* The value of linking this to Business Continuity
* Carrying out your own risk/threat/capability survey
* How the Emergency Services work in London – Gold, Silver & Bronze
* Case studies and tools that any CMT can use
* How teams actually work and the value of leadership
* Crisis Communications and what the VVO service also offers
* Perception and how crises are covered by the media
* A walk-through generic scenario exercise


Level 2 - In depth Crisis Management

A second or more bespoke tier of training is available beyond the first level, or to replace it. This is delivered over 3-4 hours wherever you suits you in Central London, or in one of out CMT rooms. This tier covers:

* An historical look at relevant crises in Central London.
* Specific case studies in detail. Protecting your reputation and operations.
* How to be a leader in a crisis situation.
* Vital tips on how to deal with the media.
* How to construct and maintain an ideal CM team plan.
* How to move from ‘slow time’ to ‘quick time’ decision making in unusual situations.
* How to detect and avoid the impact of stress and trauma in crisis situations.
* Additional tools and techniques to help a CM team move at the speed of the crisis, rather than the routine speed of the organisation impacted.
* Crisis Communications in depth and how it links to the wider VVO service.
* The Emergency Services in London and how you can understand and use yourself their command system Gold, Silver & Bronze.
* Drawing it all together, joining up the dots and avoiding litigation.
* A more in-depth generic walk-through scenario exercise


Level 3 - Scenario based exercise

A third tier of training consists of the design and facilitation ofan actual table top scenario based exercise using our extensive library of images and likely scenarios, but based entirely on a probable risk to your location plus reputation and what your own response should be.

The time taken to agree objectives, research material, rehearse the event, deliver the exercise and feed back the results will be based on your own objectives, time and budget on an individual basis.


Level 4 - Full Business continuity audit including media training

The optional final tier centres on understanding certain key risks and practising specific techniques to help you respond effectively in a crisis and afterwards. In each case a highly skilled industry professional will lead the group in a very interactive forum:

* In depth support in creating or auditing your own Business Continuity plans so they comply fully with British Standard 25999 as well as best industry practice. Delivered by people who were actually involved in helping to write BS25999.
* Coaching anyone on your team more likely to face a media camera of microphone. How to take the media high ground and give exactly the right impression to all stakeholders. This will involve creating bespoke simulated TV news broadcasts using a highly skilled ex SKY TV news presenter. This to also include at least one real team interview by an authentic TV News Crew per attendee and group feed back afterwards.
* Helping you understand the pitfalls of not treating your people correctly whenever any sort of drama occurs. Dealing with personal and group level stress and trauma during and after any dramatic incident to forestall the long term effects of a catastrophe. The facilitator has exceptional knowledge of this work based on world wide front line experience and ongoing support to a number of global organisations.

The above puts the specific details which Powers mentioned - "slow time to quick time thinking, "mock broadcasts," etc. - into their proper context, which is clearly hypothetical and office-based, and NOT the sort of thing you seem to want it to have been. What we're actually talking about is a bunch of suits in a room being shown fake news items and being asked to assess what impact an incident will have on their company, how they will respond to it both internally and externally. Are any of your premises threatened? Are they within a police cordon? Should you evacuate some, all, or most of your staff? What are the implications if they cannot get to work tomorrow, or the next day, or for a longer period? Etc.
Quote:
The head office for Tube Lines Ltd is in Canary Wharf
The head office for ICTS and Fortress GB is Tavistock Square
Verint are subcontractors for Metronet and Tube Lines Ltd as are ICTS

So it is highly plausible that the 4 were heading back to base or heading to Canary Wharf to carry out the exercise.
We know after all that the 4 were nowhere near the bombed trains.

It's entirely implausible, since what Visor clearly do does not involve "actors" out in the "real world," whether they are pretending to be bombers, injured, or whatever.
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kbo234
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watch the film:

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=8756795263359807776&q=7%2F7+ ripple+effect&total=18&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0
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