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Post which got Nazi apologist Nick Kollerstrom banned
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kbo234
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm tired by these arguments Tony.

I think people should just be prepared to disagree but accept others' integrity unless deliberate deceit is proven.

These issues are visceral and many-faceted and I am grateful to all who have genuinely made the effort to spread 9/11 Truth through the land.

Most people have made some contact with the information and in every community there is a minority that know the truth and will do something about it if the see the opportunity.

Frankly, 9/11 Truth will always be important but this 'movement' has failed in the big task. We have been divided (mostly by the 'Jewish' issues). We are ruled. There are almost certainly agents amongst us, people we know, whose only purpose of belonging to '911 Truth' is to control, divide and disempower it.

I hope everyone we know and have known will continue working to expose the truth about 9/11 but this alone will never convert people in numbers.

I do not want to continue arguing these horrible points on this forum. It is a dialogue of the deaf anyway.

You keep saying what you think and those who think that 'the Jewish issue' is a serious and important one will continue to say what we think. I can see the people who are inflicting the Satanic mindlock on us. I've read the work of the Frankfurt School. I've noted that 80% of Conservative MP's are "Friends of Israel". I understand that I live in a Zionist state. I'm in the business of trying to save the young from the horrors that I've just become aware of and I know are coming. The 'New World Order' is a fundamentally Jewish project (like 9/11 itself). The Protocols, like it or not, describes exactly what is going on and the ugly spirit of their writer is identical to the ugly spirit of the murderous lying fiends who dominate all aspects of our lives. The elites are of every nation and race but, as Guy Carr, says people "who call themselves Jews BUT ARE NOT" dominate the inner circle of this power. Pfaffing about abstractly about anomalies here and anomalies there is useful but will not harm a hair on their heads.

It is real people who are doing this. At the centre of the plot the top elite are spiritually in league with Lucifer (literally). Their own writings declare so.

Opposing facts that are false is useful enough but we must oppose these PEOPLE.......and the Judeo/Masonic ideology and conspiracy to dominate this world that they are so successfully enacting against us all.

A great crisis will resolve these issues.

If these forces get absolute control their butchery will make the Soviet Union (40-50 million killed) look like next to nothing. People have much to fight for if only they knew it. They will only stop slaughtering the cattle (i.e. us and our children) when they have exactly the number of slaves they want.

And,

1) They will not win.....and

2) The fundamental conflict is spiritual.

Can't prove it though.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kbo234 wrote:
I'm tired by these arguments Tony.

That's the spirit.
Constructive contributions welcome.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:12 am    Post subject: Tony says Middle East people are Nazi apologists Reply with quote

Tony,

Many people in the Middle East do not believe the official story on the Holocaust. They do not believe that large numbers of Jews were gassed.

If you are prepared to say that NK is an apologist for Nazism for believing this, then are you also saying many people in the Middle East are also Nazi apologists?
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Tony - You single out 'Nazi apologists' yet have spent years protecting 'Zionist apologists' and banning their detractors - it just doesn't add up for someone like you who has done the deepest of research into 'what really happened'.

@Wakeymedia: On careful re-reading, I do believe you have exposed yourself. Your choice of argument and 'protecting the movement' just no longer ring true. These type of 'arguments' sound identical to such proven diversionaries as 'Arabesque', 'Col.Jenny Sparks' and their NSA buddies.

It is way past time for offensive action, judging solely on how effective and damning 9/11 truth has now become globally. The need for defensiveness & strategy is quite exploded and totally unnecessary.

So either you are hopelessly behind the times or feel an urgent need for some more damage control, IMO.

Which is it?

--------------

Overall, I think Mr.Kollerstrom is owed an apology, if only as he has become another expendable pawn in the most vile game on the planet.

How about a little magnanimity around this overly sanctified (and at present, terribly stifling) space?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyber hiccup: duplicate post. Odd, innit?
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Arabesque", "Col.Jenny Sparks"? - that's you that is Thermate911.

You and you're ilk throwing buckets of sh*t around in this movement are exactly the kind of things and people it doesn't need. But alas they you are, and oh how you persist. Ho hum.

Here's a quote from Adolph, it's a massive clue. See if you can work it out.

Ready?

Here it is - "Today I will once more be a prophet: If the international Jewish financiers in and outside Europe should succeed in plunging the nations once more into a world war, then the result will not be the Bolshevization of the earth, and thus the victory of Jewry, but the annihilation of the Jewish race in Europe!".

There. What a giveaway.

And now over to the man himself

Link

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, what a ghastly man...

...however, the declaration in your clip took place 6 years after:-

http://www.biblestudysite.com/judeawar.htm

and an awful lot occurred in between. Eg: The recently unearthed records of the interplay between Lord Londonderry and Von Ribbentrop can be quite illuminating - and if you study the reactions of the various media of the day in context a very different picture emerges from the one we were all programmed with in our schooldays...

Did you get through those 4 books already?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thermate911 is a crypto-Nazi and there should be no tolerance for this kind of garbage regurgitated within 9/11 truth.

His post above can be summarised as "those damned Jews had it coming and Adolph wasn't THAT bad". Oh, but I almost forgot, according to Thermate911 the Holocaust didn't happen.

This kind of garbage should have no place in any campaign on 9/11. That's so obvious.

I did try to inject some focus and common sense here.

If Thermate911 is not a disinfo merchant he's doing a great impression of one.

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Last edited by Wakeymedia on Sat Nov 13, 2010 2:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh dear - tactics becoming even clearer... now I even get a whiff of Regev-speak...

I'm dooooomed ;0

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thermate911 - You are just a sad little Jew hater. What you're doing here is anyone's guess. Stubbed your toe? THE JEWS!!! were behind it. Missed the bus? THE JEWS!!! made you late. Someone points out your inconsistencies and paranoia? They must at least be like A JEW!!!, like THAT JEW!!! Regev.

Why are you doing this to yourself? Have at least some standards. Just a suggestion.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The interested researcher of posts here has only to skim through mine over the years to clearly see where I come from and how blatant your attempted misdirection has become in this thread.

Sad stuff, Wakeymedia.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wakeymedia the Hasbara merchant.....are you a Zionazi like Dogsmilk, Chek et al.?

EMIGRATION: THE FINAL SOLUTION

.....Prof. Rassinier is emphatically stating that the German Government never had any policy other than the emigration of Jews overseas. He shows that after the promulgation of the Nuremberg Race Laws in September 1935, the Germans negotiated with the British for the transfer of German Jews to Palestine on the basis of the Balfour Declaration......

....The order for this concentration in the eastern ghetto was given by Goering to Heydrich, as noted earlier, and it was regarded as a prelude to
"the desired final solution," their emigration overseas after the war had ended..........R.E. Harwood.

The Amazing Rita Katz and S.I.T.E.

GORDON DUFF AND BRIAN JOBERT: IS ISRAEL CONTROLLING PHONY TERROR NEWS?

http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=30111

Recommend the postings of Alicethekurious.!
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thermate911 - any "researcher" can see your posts on this one thread. They are what I am responding to and I'm on rock solid ground so far. Sorry.

Yours sincerely,

"Regev".

Have a nice day.

. . . Oh and Blackbear, your fantasy land may have become convincing to you but Adolph's very own words here (a few posts above) are something you'll have to listen to one day. I know it may be difficult and jarring for you. Also Blackbear - would you say Rumbula and Babi Yar were "emigration"? Would you say that the Gassing Vans (Gaswagen) were "emigration"? Would you say that the testimonies of actual SS guards from Auschwitz: Oskar Gröning, Hans Münch and Josef Klehr were simply fantasy?

And I would like to ask, in all seriousness, Blackbear and Thermate911 - do either of you follow any particular religion?

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Wakeymedia:

From your youtube page:-

Quote:
"One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we have been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We are no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It is simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we have been so credulous." - Carl Sagan


Quote:
"They could be made to accept the most flagrant violations of reality, because they never fully grasped the enormity of what was demanded of them, and were not sufficiently interested in public events to notice what was happening" - George Orwell, 1984.


Perhaps you have had these quotes up so long, you have forgotten their true import? And whilst we're in this tedious pot-kettle-black loop, you seem to have sidestepped the 1933 International Jewry (ie: Banksters) declaration of war on Germany - why is that? It is most certainly "something you'll have to listen to one day".

Have you read at least W.G.Carr yet? It would save you much embarrassment, IMO.

Religion? I am not a great one for labels, but as mentioned above, you will find all such information in my posts if you weren't so hell-bent on going off half-cocked. For the record, and despite being partly Jewish (paternal grandmother), Mahayana Buddhist is 'best fit' for those intent on categorising me... Perhaps you might care to look into the Tibetan 'Holocaust' - never mentioned in 'polite' circles...

And to misquote Peter Sellers: "Don't you dare call me a crypto-Nazi until I look it up in a dictionary!" ;-)

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wakeymedia,

If the chemical evidence collected at Auschwitz cannot be contradicted then it is you who are throwing around the buckets of s***!

Words are cheap. It is easy to get people to lie. If you don't know this you know nothing.

This is not to say there was not a wicked horror perpetrated against Jews in Germany. We are talking about one aspect of these events. Easily the most mind-numbingly evil one.

In a court of law physical evidence trumps any verbal testimony. You surely know that.

We know what you believe but a belief is not the truth unless it can be convincingly verified by evidence.

The most powerful evidence so far revealed on this issue is, unfortunately (or not), against you.

Let us admit that for some, as yet unexplained, reason the chemical evidence might be flawed and you (and the narrative of what NK calls "the vision of ghastly horror"), are correct.

This must be demonstrated.

Frankly, I fail to see how you can disagree with any of the above.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thermate911 - A Buddhist Jew hater. Wow. You are one confused bunny. Good luck to you, I hope you sort it out one day. Don't bother with any more comments to me: I do have standards. Toodle pip.

kbo234 - I can't agree or disagree with "any of the above" as it was pure gibberish. What the hell are you going on about? You didn't say anything.

You've chosen to or are eager to believe that Auschwitz was a branch of Butlins for some reason probably not fully understood by even yourself.

This is my last comment on your ravings. You're sad little people who unfortunately have chosen to attach yourselves to an essential campaign (9/11) and your unhinged drivel does serious damage to that campaign.

Goodbye.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, that's a relief!

Perhaps now the emotional mudslinging and you're-not-white-therefore-you-must-be-black line of 'reasoning' is over for the time being, we can get on with diligently searching for the truth buried within the bankster's 'grand illusion', which in its present form has had mankind in its almost total thrall for the last 200 years?

Who was it around here who often quoted something along the lines of 'belief being the downfall (or was it 'enemy') of Truth', as kbo234 so lucidly pointed out once again above?

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2010/11/13/gordon-duff-who-speaks-up-for- holocaust-survivors/

Quote:
GORDON DUFF: WHO SPEAKS UP FOR HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS

November 13, 2010 posted by Gordon Duff

AS MANY AS 90% OF THOSE CLAIMING TO BE HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS MAY BE FRAUDS

By Gordon Duff STAFF WRITER/Senior Editor

Last week, 17 men were arrested in New York for defrauding Germany out of $42 million in payments to phony holocaust survivors. Tens of thousands of American Jews had filed for pensions from Germany claiming to be concentration camp survivors. All swore they had been in the camps, told stories about gas chambers, human skin lampshades and such but not a single one had been in a camp at all. The state of Israel claims to have, alive today, nearly one million holocaust survivors.

As many as 90% of these may well be, not only frauds but many could easily be former concentration camp guards themselves, far more likely than surviving death camps. What better place to hide than Israel?

With numbers of camp survivors going up each year, we tend to forget we are talking about death camps. There were few survivors and most of them died immediately after the war. Those alive were found dying and couldn’t be saved, and most of them weren’t Jews but rather Russians, Gypsies, Communists, trade unionists and anti-Fascists.

Look at the numbers. There were only 5.3 million Jews listed as living in Europe, outside the USSR, in 1940. In a rough average, 12 death camps, filled to the brim with gas chambers and crematoriums ran 24 hours a day for 1000 days. Some are said, in testimony of literally thousands, to have killed from 17,000 to 20,000 per day. Lets use the figure, 10,000 per day times 12 camps times 1000 days.

Where do a million survivors come from? I can see a thousand, ten thousand but not 30,000 and certainly not the 15 million necessary to justify the current number of claimed survivors according to typical actuarial tables for healthy adults of the period, those who were not starved and tortured for years. Look at Vietnam veterans. Only 700,000 of 2.9 million survive 35 years after the war. Something is wrong here.

STOLEN VALOR

There are laws in the United States that punish people who wear military medals they didn’t earn or claim other such honors. When veterans discover someone claiming falsely to have served in war, that individual is arrested but also publicly humiliated. They are hunted down like dogs.

There are concentration camp survivors living in America, people who suffered incomprehensibly at the hands of the Nazis. However, there are also, in America we now know, tens of thousands or more who claim falsely to be of the heroic numbers from that period and numbers inside Israel that are unimaginable. Why are these people not punished?

As a Vietnam veteran, I share a common problem with others. For 4 decades, I met veteran after veteran, many were children when the war ended, but each claims some honor tied to military service based on a movie or television show. I have met, over the years, hundreds of such individuals, many at meetings of veterans organizations. I don’t find it horrible or destructive but it is disturbing and I won’t even remotely begin comparing service in Vietnam with the experience of a death camp.

LAST WEEK

Last week, authorities announced that those who had wrongly filed for benefits had been fooled somehow. I can see fooling someone as to whether they had seen a televisions show or not but there is only one American I can think of who imagined he had been in a death camp who hadn’t and that was President Ronald Reagan and he only claimed to have visited. Reagan’s error was based on dementia, not profit or gain. Now it seems, not only do we have tens of thousands of people who have a single false memory, they seem to remember years of horror, incredible detail and all of it is utterly false. There is no comparison, not with Reagan, not with Vietnam veterans, not with anyone.

Reagan’s error, despite the respect he is held in and his obvious illness, was been used to defame him countless times. His error was not only honest but done in the context of human feeling. How many of the others are lying, not only for financial gain but for something less wholesome?

Why then, in the name of all that is holy, did the authorities and news media immediately write this off as tens of thousands of cases of minor lapses in judgement rather than one of the most horrible moral crimes of all time?

There is no greater disrespect for a holocaust victim than this.

REVISIONISTS AND DENIERS

Two thousand people in Europe are in prison today for questioning some part, no matter how minor, of the holocaust. The official story of the holocaust is a compendium of testimony of several hundred thousand people as there was little physical evidence left at the end of the war. Some facilities were reconstructed based on testimony, for historical perspective but in general, it is believed that the Germans destroyed all evidence of death camps and mass graves when they learned they were losing the war.

Thousands of those who find this explanation unsatisfactory and had chosen to disagree, some noted historians, some scientists and some simple troublemakers and activists, have been imprisoned. At the trials, holocaust victims claimed that such questioning harmed them irreparably. However, not one holocaust victim has ever spoken up about the endless numbers of phony holocaust victims who besmirch them every day and have for nearly 65 years. Why is that?

One thing the revisionists claim is that almost every story from the holocaust, including notable books and even world famous holocaust survivors are, in actuality, the worst phonies of all. The analogy of the “phony veteran” is applicable here. After each war, endless numbers of those, who for reasons legitimate or not, felt their contribution to the war effort was less than honorable or noteworthy, claim accomplishments they are undeserving of. It is also known that combat veterans are seldom seen on bar stools at service organizations talking about heroic exploits.

In fact, as Americans are learning more and more each day, combat veterans have great difficulty surviving coming home and are often homeless, incarcerated and commit suicide in huge numbers. It would be easy to extrapolate the same for holocaust survivors. There is no greater potential cause of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder in the history of mankind than the concentration camps of World War 2. Not only would survivors kill themselves out of guilt, most would suffer greatly shortened lifespans. This has been amazingly well documented.

This being the case, only a few hundred holocaust survivors could be alive today, not the one million living in Israel.


HONESTY AND TRUTH

Anyone imprisoned wrongly, anyone whose family was killed or whose assets were seized illegally, should be compensated. Anyone wrongly claiming to be part of a group they are not, one this unique in the history of mankind, deserves punishment. Why is this not done? Why is there no normal social pressure to “out” these people and defend the honor of holocaust survivors?

Has anyone ever asked a real holocaust survivor what it is like to see phonies continually on television talking about the holocaust? Do they forgive? We will never know, as it seems nobody cares about real holocaust survivors. The holocaust is brought up when Israel bombs a school or asks for foreign aid but as for the people themselves, these misuses of the suffering of some cheapen human misery and the human condition.

NEVER AGAIN, WHAT DOES IT REALLY MEAN?

If one child was taken away, died in a gas chamber, typhus, shot, it doesn’t matter, one life, this is a holocaust. If it was done because of race, the crime is doubly evil in nature. The lesson of “never again” was meant to be a lesson for all mankind to treat every single life with the same honor and respect, not to use the suffering of some as an excuse for financial crime, self delusion or outrageous acts of aggression.

Instead, the holocaust has become theatre, a stage for two sides to debate, to play, to “lawyer” the world to death. Some feel they should fight the holocaust because it has become a tool of evil. Some defend it because it is a tool of evil also but they believe the world is evil and only evil men are meant to survive.

Picture the death of a single child. Then go to the trial of a “holocaust denier.” Who is evil? Who is good? Do any of them ever think of the single child or only how it died, who signed what or how many Palestinian children could be murdered just like that child, in that child’s name perhaps?

THE REAL WAR

Why ask the question if 6 million Jews died? It is equally possible that 6 million Germans died in the Ukraine and Europe, not soldiers, not in air raids, but in a holocaust type extinction. This is not talked of but it happened. All of us, Jews, Germans, the west, all of us, were silent when Josef Stalin killed twice that number or more. It started before the war and continued after. The human suffering caused by Stalin was immeasurable but is never spoken of, barely touched on except by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn and now his books are banned. They fail to conform to popular mythology.

There was nothing pure about the real war as there is nothing pure about wars today. The myths we may or may not make up to protect some are never really to protect anyone. The weak and vulnerable are never protected, only the powerful. This is how the powerful become such and remain that way. We are such liars.

Nobody ever cared about the holocaust survivors only what using their suffering would bring in honor and riches. Is this the truth? Is this the partial truth? Has anyone asked the hard questions, the real questions? Isn’t it time that all the survivors got together? Some voice is needed, a voice that can say “never again’ with authority.

But..”never again”…what?
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Gordon can be quite brutal. But then he is a disenchanted and disenfranchised Marine Vet who gave up his health in unwitting support of the Zionist/Thule Big Lie.

What I cannot fathom (at least from people who profess to be genuine researchers into 9/11 Truth) is the appalling disconnect and levels of cognitive dissonance. Here we are uncovering a monumental pyramid of lies, deceit and mass murder yet at the same time many here ignore previous episodes of lies, deceit and mass murder from the same stinking stable of psychopaths!

Are so few posters here capable of drawing parallels (based on subsequently uncovered fact, largely gained by people who have since had their lives utterly ruined if not destroyed for exposing the truth) between the official story of 9/11, the official story of OKC, the official story of WWI, WWII and the official story of THE Holocaust[tm]?

Yes, of course the latter appalling mass murder occurred, to the shame of all humanity but, just as with 7/7, Madrid, 9/11, OKC, JFK, Stalin, Hitler, Churchill, Roosevelt etc ad nauseum, it did not occur as we have been taught and it certainly did not apply just to Jews, the worlds' perennial victims now turned aggressors, the latter being their true amoral nature.

Hey ho.

It didn't seem to make much difference when I quoted from Gilad Atzmon a few posts back, so here's the entire article, which can also be found on kbo234's blog at http://kevboyle.blogspot.com/

http://www.gilad.co.uk/writings/truth-history-and-integrity-by-gilad-a tzmon.html

Quote:
Truth, History and Integrity by Gilad Atzmon
DateSaturday, March 13, 2010 at 2:02PM


Back in 2007 the notorious American Jewish right-wing organization, the ADL (Anti-Defamation League) announced that it recognised the events in which an estimated 1.5 million Armenians were massacred as "genocide." The ADL's national director, Abraham Foxman, insisted that he made the decision after discussing the matter with ‘historians’. For some reason he failed to mention who the historians were, nor did he refer to their credibility or field of scholarship. However, Foxman also consulted with one holocaust survivor who supported the decision. It was Elie Wiesel, not known for being a leading world expert on the Armenian ordeal.

The idea of a Zionist organization being genuinely concerned, or even slightly moved, by other people’s suffering could truly be a monumental transforming moment in Jewish history. However, this week we learned that the ADL is once again engaged in the dilemma of Armenian suffering. It is not convinced anymore that the Armenians suffered that much. It is now lobbying the American congress not to recognize the killings of Armenians as ‘genocide. This week saw the ADL “speaking out against Congressional acknowledgment of the Armenian Genocide, and is, instead, advocating Turkey’s call for a historical commission to study the events.”

How is it that an event that took place a century ago is causing such a furor? One day it is generally classified as ‘genocide’, the next, it is demoted to an ordinary instance of one man killing another. Was it an ‘historical document’ that, out of nowhere, popped out on Abe Foxman’s desk? Are there some new factual revelations that led to such a dramatic historical shift? l don’t think so.

The ADL’s behaviour is a glimpse into the notion of Jewish history and the Jewish understanding of the past. For the nationalist and political Jew, history is a pragmatic tale, it is an elastic account. It is foreign to any scientific or academic method. Jewish history transcends itself beyond factuality, truthfulness or correspondence rules with any given vision of reality. It also repels integrity or ethics. It by far prefers total submission, instead of creative and critical thinking. Jewish history is a phantasmic tale that is there to make the Jews happy and the Goyim behave themselves. It is there to serve the interests of one tribe and that tribe only. In practice, from a Jewish perspective, the decision whether there was an Armenian genocide or not is subject to Jewish interests: is it good for the Jews or is it good for Israel.

Interestingly enough, history is not a particularly ‘Jewish thing’. It is an established fact that not a single Jewish historical text has been written between the 1st century (Josephus Flavius) and early 19th century (Isaak Markus Jost). For almost 2 thousand years Jews were not interested in their own or anyone else’s past, at least not enough to chronicle it. As a matter of convenience, an adequate scrutiny of the past was never a primary concern within the Rabbinical tradition. One of the reasons is probably that there was no need for such a methodical effort. For the Jew who lived during ancient times and the Middle Ages, there was enough in the Bible to answer the most relevant questions to do with day-to-day life, Jewish meaning and fate. As Israeli historian Shlomo Sand puts it, “a secular chronological time was foreign to the ‘Diaspora time’ that was shaped by the anticipation for the coming of the Messiah.”

However, in the mid 19th century, in the light of secularisation, urbanisation, emancipation and due to the decreasing authority of the Rabbinical leaders, an emerging need of an alternative cause rose amongst the awakening European Jews. All of a sudden, the emancipated Jew had to decide who he was and where he came from. He also started to speculate what his role might be within the rapidly opening Western society.

This is where Jewish history in its modern form was invented. This is also where Judaism was transformed from a world religion into a ‘land registry’ with some clearly devastating racially orientated and expansionist implications. As we know, Shlomo Sand’s account of the ‘Jewish Nation’ as a fictional invention is yet to be challenged academically. However, the dismissal of factuality or commitment to truthfulness is actually symptomatic of any form of contemporary Jewish collective ideology and identity politics. The ADL’s treatment of the Armenian topic is just one example. The Zionist’s dismissal of a Palestinian past and heritage is just another example. But in fact any Jewish collective vision of the past is inherently Judeo-centric and oblivious to any academic or scientific procedure.

When I was Young

When I was young and naïve I regarded history as a serious academic matter. As I understood it, history had something to do with truth seeking, documents, chronology and facts. I was convinced that history aimed to convey a sensible account of the past based on methodical research. I also believed that it was premised on the assumption that understanding the past may throw some light over our present and even help us to shape a prospect of a better future. I grew up in the Jewish state and it took me quite a while to understand that the Jewish historical narrative is very different. In the Jewish intellectual ghetto, one decides what the future ought to be, then one constructs ‘a past’ accordingly. Interestingly enough, this exact method is also prevalent amongst Marxists. They shape the past so it fits nicely into their vision of the future. As the old Russian joke says, “when the facts do not conform with the Marxist ideology, the Communist social scientists amend the facts (rather than revise the theory)”.

When I was young, I didn’t think that history was a matter of political decisions or agreements between a rabid Zionist lobby and its favorite holocaust survivor. I regarded historians as scholars who engaged in adequate research following some strict procedures. When I was young I even considered becoming an historian.

When I was young and naive I was also somehow convinced that what they told us about our ‘collective’ Jewish past really happened. I believed it all, the Kingdom of David, Massada, and then the Holocaust: the soap, the lampshade*, the death march, the six million.

As it happened, it took me many years to understand that the Holocaust, the core belief of the contemporary Jewish faith, was not at all an historical narrative for historical narratives do not need the protection of the law and politicians. It took me years to grasp that my great-grandmother wasn’t made into a ‘soap’ or a ‘lampshade’*. She probably perished out of exhaustion, typhus or maybe even by mass shooting. This was indeed bad and tragic enough, however not that different from the fate of many millions of Ukrainians who learned what communism meant for real. “Some of the worst mass murderers in history were Jews” writes Zionist Sever Plocker on the Israeli Ynet disclosing the Holodomor and Jewish involvement in this colossal crime, probably the greatest crime of the 20th century. The fate of my great-grandmother was not any different from hundreds of thousands of German civilians who died in an orchestrated indiscriminate bombing, because they were Germans. Similarly, people in Hiroshima died just because they were Japanese. 1 million Vietnamese died just because they were Vietnamese and 1.3 million Iraqis died because they were Iraqis. In short the tragic circumstances of my great grandmother wasn’t that special after all.

It Doesn’t make sense

It took me years to accept that the Holocaust narrative, in its current form, doesn’t make any historical sense. Here is just one little anecdote to elaborate on:

If, for instance, the Nazis wanted the Jews out of their Reich (Judenrein - free of Jews), or even dead, as the Zionist narrative insists, how come they marched hundreds of thousands of them back into the Reich at the end of the war? I have been concerned with this simple question for more than a while. I eventually launched into an historical research of the topic and happened to learn from Israeli holocaust historian professor Israel Gutman that Jewish prisoners actually joined the march voluntarily. Here is a testimony taken from Gutman’s book

"One of my friends and relatives in the camp came to me on the night of the evacuation and offered a common hiding place somewhere on the way from the camp to the factory. …The intention was to leave the camp with one of the convoys and to escape near the gate, using the darkness we thought to go a little far from the camp. The temptation was very strong. And yet, after I considered it all I then decided to join (the march) with all the other inmates and to share their fate " (Israel Gutman [editor], People and Ashes: Book Auschwitz - Birkenau, Merhavia 1957).

I am left puzzled here, if the Nazis ran a death factory in Auschwitz-Birkenau, why would the Jewish prisoners join them at the end of the war? Why didn’t the Jews wait for their Red liberators?

I think that 65 years after the liberation of Auschwitz, we must be entitled to start to ask the necessary questions. We should ask for some conclusive historical evidence and arguments rather than follow a religious narrative that is sustained by political pressure and laws. We should strip the holocaust of its Judeo-centric exceptional status and treat it as an historical chapter that belongs to a certain time and place

65 years after the liberation of Auschwitz we should reclaim our history and ask why? Why were the Jews hated? Why did European people stand up against their next door neighbours? Why are the Jews hated in the Middle East, surely they had a chance to open a new page in their troubled history? If they genuinely planned to do so, as the early Zionists claimed, why did they fail? Why did America tighten its immigration laws amid the growing danger to European Jews? We should also ask for what purpose do the holocaust denial laws serve? What is the holocaust religion there to conceal? As long as we fail to ask questions, we will be subjected to Zionists and their Neocons agents’ plots. We will continue killing in the name of Jewish suffering. We will maintain our complicity in Western imperialist crimes against humanity.

As devastating as it may be, at a certain moment in time, a horrible chapter was given an exceptionally meta-historical status. Its ‘factuality’ was sealed by draconian laws and its reasoning was secured by social and political settings. The Holocaust became the new Western religion. Unfortunately, it is the most sinister religion known to man. It is a license to kill, to flatten, no nuke, to wipe, to rape, to loot and to ethnically cleanse. It made vengeance and revenge into a Western value. However, far more concerning is the fact that it robs humanity of its heritage, it is there to stop us from looking into our past with dignity. Holocaust religion robs humanity of its humanism. For the sake of peace and future generations, the holocaust must be stripped of its exceptional status immediately. It must be subjected to thorough historical scrutiny. Truth and truth seeking is an elementary human experience. It must prevail.

*During WWII and after it was widely believed that soaps and lampshades were being mass produced from the bodies of Jewish victims. In recent years the Israeli Holocaust museum admitted that there was no truth in any of those accusations.


@ian neal & Tony Gosling - we will continue having 'this discussion' until either 'history' is resolved conclusively or the few of us prepared to go the whole route get banned (or far worse fate!) again. Sorry, but that's what always happens when unpalatable fact knocks belief sideways. Either fact gets buried or belief gets changed.

Your choice...

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wakeymedia wrote:

You've chosen to or are eager to believe that Auschwitz was a branch of Butlins for some reason probably not fully understood by even yourself.


You're absolutely full of s***.

You are a dishonest coward whose, when faced with something you can't handle, resort to simple abuse.

A familiar phenomenon, most surely.

It amazes me that you are interested in 9/11 at all. I can't help wondering if the only reason for your passion on the subject is to carry out just such attacks on people who can join a dot or two.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No detail in your criticism, just bile here Kevin.
And inaccurate bile at that Wink
You sound like a man who has lost an argument.
Terminally.
kbo234 wrote:
You're absolutely full of s***.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glory be! Editorial bias at work in spades; isn't this a bit blatant, Tony? ;-)

Wakeymedia wrote:
... ... ...You and you're ilk throwing buckets of sh*t around in this movement are exactly the kind of things and people it doesn't need. ... ... ...


These so far unremarked & unedited "buckets of sh*t" have to be faced sometime by anyone deeply concerned with upholding the truth. Why not now, why not here? Why not help concerned people get a clearer picture of at least who they should avoid having any dealings with whatsoever on this benighted planet?

This thread's getting to be as difficult as papering a hall through the letter box - why should that be when the facts are at hand?

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Item 8's post is interesting but the figure of 2000 in jail for denying the Holocaust has got to be an exaggeration. He doesn't reference it so maybe Dave Sherlock (thermate) or Kevin Boyle (kbo) can help us out?

Meanwhile... Talking about someone 'throwing sh** around' is not the same as attesting that the person you are discussing these issues with is 'full of sh**'.

Maybe one of our two one trick ponies would like to contort their brains ino explaining why it is? And why deciding one comment is acceptable and the other isn't is 'editorial bias'? But I won't hold my breath.

Nazi apologists and their cohorts tend to end up disappearing in a puff of brown smoke round here.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TonyGosling wrote:

You sound like a man who has lost an argument.


What argument?!

There is no argument.

There is only determined avoidance of uncomfortable data placed in the public domain by people who have carried out real research.

The only reason I engage in this is to point out the dishonesty of 911 'truthers' who can obssess about evidence on one issue and completely ignore it on another.

....and it is not as if this is an irrelevant issue, Tony.

'The Holocaust' has been driving middle eastern wars for the last 60+ years and protecting the Zionists who have taken over our country and the USA.

....AND YOU KNOW IT.

The reason people 'disappear like smoke' is not because they lose the argument but because they recognise futility and dishonesty when they get involved in it.

......and yes, I do not like being called a Nazi, nor do I like to hear my friends, people of almost absurd decency, called Nazis. This is what I would expect from the professional liars in the mainstream media.

Neither is it 'personal' abuse that hurts (I think I know who I am) but it is the wrenching despair of realising that even people who are seemingly (and I would not question your integrity) dedicated to overthrowing the powers-that-be can resort to this sort of stuff in an instant and resort to abuse against people who have sacrificed more to the cause of genuine truthseeking than they ever will.

....and, to remind you, I do not say there was no 'Holocaust', nor no persecution....and neither does NK. He says there are serious questions about the narrative of mass extermination by human gas chambers and that, based on evidence, these questions properly should be addressed.

But hey hoe,

Israel will gets its War against Iran and in the howling abyss that will surely be its aftermath we will wonder why we allowed these people to ravage the world unmolested until the inevitable finally came to pass.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting post today from Henry Makow on the general theme of fraudulent history.

Quotes from the article:
".....And if Wikipedia calls your work anti-Semitic or a 'conspiracy theory' it is a MUST READ.

.......I have been playing with another Churchill quote. "Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.......

......But how can we remember what we were never allowed to learn? History is intentionally misrepresented to us, so we are virtually doomed to repeat it. "

Here is the whole thing:


History Repeated When Suppressed November 15, 2010 by Andrew Smith
for henrymakow.com

"It is impossible to obtain a conviction for sodomy from an English jury. Half of them don't believe that it can be done, and the other half are doing it." - Winston Churchill

Winston Churchill probably had first-hand knowledge of the above subject. More to his credit, i learned in James Bacque's book, Other Losses, that Churchill was outraged by plans to exterminate Germans after the war.

In fact, while the American and the French POW Camps were starving their German POWs in April and May 1945, the British were properly housing and feeding their prisoners.

I have been playing with another Churchill quote. "Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

Churchill's saying was actually plagiarized from George Santayana writings in 1905-06, The Life of Reason; "Progress, far from consisting in change, depends on retentiveness.... When experience is not retained, as among savages, infancy is perpetual. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

But how can we remember what we were never allowed to learn? History is intentionally misrepresented to us, so we are virtually doomed to repeat it.

No history that substantially deviates from the 'party line' reaches American mass media . Any deviating histories first get ignored. If the deviating historical ideas continue to gain attention, the author is usually smeared or otherwise discredited.

Consider the way Wikipedia smears James Bacque's book, Other Losses (1989). In this book, Bacque exposes the French and American extermination camps where surrendering WW II German forces were sent to slowly die of starvation, disease and exposure.

It wasn't easy reading Other Loses. Bacque methodically documents the intentional extermination of at least 750,000 and maybe as many as 1,000,000 German soldiers in April and May 1945.

Critics argue about the precise numbers of surrendering German soldiers who died in "temporary enclosures" but the inhuman treatment cannot be denied. The fact that Bacques puts Ike in a bad light for his role is actually a subsidiary issue. Like the Nazi War Criminal hung at Nuremberg, Ike was 'just following orders.'

Bacque's major contribution is proving that FDR, Stalin and Churchill openly discussed the issue of starving (and Stalin shooting) surrendering German soldiers long before the end of WW II.

The treatment of former members of the German army was not just happenstance but the execution of the 'Morgenthau plan' to render Germany harmless forever. The plan was not directed against the German leadership or Nazis, but the German people at large.

Germany's grim fate was sealed at Yalta. And all the arguments of the allied leaders in all the meetings leading up to Yalta, Feb 1945, Bacque covers in the opening nine pages of Chapter One of his book. THIS IS MUST READ MATERIAL.

Smearing Bacque's book, Wikipedia avoids the Allied executive decisions by claiming simply, "There is debate about the merits of Other Losses' claims. Several historians, such as Stephen Ambrose (Ike's biographer) and seven other historians examining the book soon after its publication, dispute it and consider it inaccurate and the product of conspiracy theory." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Other_Losses

The Wiki article ducks the thrust of Other Losses and devotes 95% of its smear to the panel (of seven) assembled in New Orleans to discredit the book. Churchill and the British OPENLY condemned what the USSR, America and France did to their prisoners. The British POW camps sheltered and fed its prisoners. The Wiki article totally ignores the British protests at the time. Were the British part of Bacque's 'conspiracy' to distort the truth 45 years before Other Losses was published?

If we put Other Losses beside Julius Epstein's Operation Keelhaul,The Story of Forced Repatriation (1973) a very disturbing pattern slaps us in the face. Epstein's book explains how America returned hundreds of thousands of anti-communists fleeing the Iron Curtain. American forces returned these people after the beginning of the Cold War. MANY RETURNED ANTI-COMMUNISTS WERE HUNG in the presences of American soldiers.

This repatriation was unknown to the American public in the 1940s and remains unknown today. Obviously the same people running the USSR still run America. Like Epstein, Bacque just reported the facts. The 'conspiracy theory' lies not in what Bacque or Epstein wrote but in the conclusions you must reach when you see the big picture.

The best mental control is cultural control. This is not complicated stuff. The best culture control is history control. Humans learn best by imitation in order to 'please' and fit in.

But in school we are given fictional accounts of real events. This is history control. That is why writers like James Bacque and Julius Epstein are so dangerous. They bring the big picture into focus. Wiki is obviously just a fancy disinfo site. If Wiki doesn't piss on you, you are not very worthy or reliable. And if Wiki calls your work anti-Semitic or a 'conspiracy theory' it is a MUST READ.

http://www.savethemales.ca/

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey ho, indeed!

This is probably (once again!) my last post around here as frankly, Tony, I find your blatantly biased and minimalist responses beyond pathetic. No puffs of brown smoke here, as it can be clearly demonstrated that some posters, of which I claim to be one, have been consistent in their aims since day one - and by 'day one' I mean realising that even before 9/11, a major false flag attack on America had become an inevitability after the Seattle and Prague protests, because the banksters were not getting their own way.

All I see here and now are a few (perhaps unwitting) gatekeepers, wrapped in the security blanket of their 'One True G-d', a god imposed upon them for generations by the very same faction you supposedly set this site up to expose. How dare one tribe amongst millions on this planet set themselves up as supremacists? Very effectively, it would seem, thanks to woolly-minded followers!

Now it's beginning to look like that security blanket is, lemming-like, going to trip you over the cliff into their chaos and destruction - and all because you won't act decisively to save yourselves.

Perhaps this site should be renamed the Niemoller911Forum.il ?

It appears that no-one here is interested in discussing the findings of the devoutly Christian W.Guy Carr so how about Edwin Black? Any takers?


Link


and

http://www.stockmaven.com/transfer_A.htm

The Transfer Agreement:
The Dramatic Story of the Pact Between the Third Reich and Jewish Palestine
by Edwin Black



David Sherlock? No, but I do have a passing connection to Dr. Parnassus ;-)

For claims on number of people at present 'constrained by law' for questioning the veracity of the official story of THE Holocaust[tm] why don't you ask the original author of the piece? He is very accessible, as is Gilad Atzmon.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why is it 'biased' to discriminate between talking about someone 'throwing * around' and then a reply coming back that the other person is 'full of *'?
I make my decisions based on the evidence and whether people argue convincingly ... and you and Kevin fail on both counts. You simply spit when you lose. And you flag yourself up as such.
Goodbye again, Dave.
Rolling Eyes

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TonyGosling wrote:
Why is it 'biased' to discriminate between talking about someone 'throwing * around' and then a reply coming back that the other person is 'full of *'?
I make my decisions based on the evidence and whether people argue convincingly ... and you and Kevin fail on both counts. You simply spit when you lose. And you flag yourself up as such.
Goodbye again, Dave.
Rolling Eyes




I thought we had by overwhelming evidence realised that the Jews who did suffer, suffered predominantly because of their own brethrens plans for world domination and even acknowledged before the event by prominent Zionists? With even direct reference to this subject. Some even saying before hand, as a necessary sacrifice. For the meme we have seen play out since, “look what the Nazi’s did to the Jews” but really was done by some of their own people who are whatever label you can name, but for the purpose of world domination for them alone.

Such as in the narrative of the book “A world without Jews” By Karl Marx. Which obviously did not mean that those counterfeit Jews at the top (Not all Jews), wanted to rid the world of all counterfeit Jews. What he perhaps meant shouldn’t take too much to work out, when people talk in opposite meanings and lies.


By Zionists I mean of the 33 kind and all its tentacles and names used. Which don’t necessarily have to be counterfeit Jews, but we also know they play a big part in it. Most researchers throughout history would say the biggest part.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now you are just getting personal and nitpicking, Tony. It really doesn't become you trying to convey that black is white.

No spitting here, just knowledge based on established fact - fact you seem unable to refute whilst doing an editorial flip number.

Oh, and before Gordon Duff's Nov.11th appalling article from JB Campbell hits this site, I would like to point out that from my perspective he is only pushing half the story. It may appear on the surface that the Thule faction has lost out...but what's the point of discussing subtleties here any more?

NotDave.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony, you are disingenuous and deluded.

You did'nt 'win' any argument.

You just pick up my responding to the word s*** as abuse with the word s*** as abuse...........and then desperately try to imagine that this has something to do with an serious argument (which, in reality, has not even taken place).

You guys are avoiding an argument by failing to even engage with an alleged reality (NK's paper on the research of Leuchter and Rudolf).

If you can't come up with any kind of a rebuttal, I reasonably (it is surely fair to say) deduce that you have LOST the only confrontation of substance that matters on this thread.

(Here comes the name-calling) ....see ya.

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