It has begun: Troops to patrol Italy's streets

Mark Gobell · Post by **Mark Gobell** » Sun Jun 15, 2008 8:56 pm

Row in Italy over army deployment

A political row has broken out in Italy over the government's decision to deploy troops on the streets of major Italian cities to fight against crime.

About 2,500 soldiers are to be deployed for a maximum period of one year.

The opposition has described the move as a mistake. "We are not in Colombia," said opposition MP Antonio di Pietro.

The police say it will not work - the government's decision is tantamount to saying they are not up to the task of maintaining law and order.

Travellers at Milan's main railway station could be among the first to experience the government's new strategy, says the BBC's Mark Duff in the northern Italian city.

'Authoritarian?'

Up to 300 soldiers are expected to carry out patrols and security checks there to help combat muggers and pickpockets.

In an attempt to calm its critics, the government now says soldiers will only be deployed on an experimental basis for at most a year, but that has not been enough to satisfy everyone, our correspondent says.

"Using armed forces to control cities is a mistake by an authoritarian regime," said Antonio Di Pietro, who heads a small centre-left party.

"We are not in Colombia where these forces are used to fight terrorism and armed insurrection," he said, warning that the move would threaten tourism to Italy.

Centre-left leader Walter Veltroni described the move as "the wrong choice that humiliates forces of law and order".

Italy's defence minister, however, says there is no risk of confrontation between the army and the police.

Ignazio la Russa recalled that it had been the centre-left Italian opposition to order the deployment of the army in 1992, after anti-Mafia magistrates Giovanni Falcone and Paolo Borsellino were assassinated in Sicily.

It is believed to be the only peacetime deployment since WWII.

Source

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Sun Jun 15, 2008 10:08 pm

The Italians already have a big police presence on their streets. They have different types of police, military, financial and one more like ours as I remember.

But this is certainly a worrying development.

telecasterisation · Post by **telecasterisation** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:34 pm

What a very 'closed' article;

It goes no distance in explaining the depth of the problem that warrants the use of armed forces, also what powers do the military actually have in this context?

Will they just walk about looking all armed and green? Plus what is the procedure if they/when they come across someone they suspect of pickpocketing, or actually catch in the act/with stolen gear?

kookomula · Post by **kookomula** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 6:05 pm

Very odd. I had dinner with some post-grad medical students in Rome in January and they said the only time there was any trouble was after football matches, otherwise, very peaceful.

Mark Gobell · Post by **Mark Gobell** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 6:08 pm

Italy Calls On Army To Help Fight Crime

Updated:14:37, Monday June 16, 2008

Army will be used as 'a deterrent'

The government wants to use the army alongside local police officers for "specific and exceptional crime-prevention missions".

Defence Minister Ignazio La Russa said the proposal was designed as a deterrent and a "demonstration of the presence of the state".

The right-wing Milan Mayor Letizia Moratti hailed the proposed project as "very positive" and "an important warning signal" from the government at a time when many Italians felt unsafe.

But opposition parties and police unions have strongly criticised the plan.

Antonio Di Pietro, head of a small centre-left party, said in a statement: "Using armed forces to control cities is a mistake by an authoritarian regime."

The Naples garbage crisis

The left-wing SILP-CGIL questioned what it said would be a "very costly and inefficient facade operation".

Head of the SIULP police union Felice Romano said: "Using the army for security is like letting a bull into a china shop."

Former army chief of staff, General Mario Arpino, said it would be "bizarre" to see soldiers doing the same things in Italy as in Kosovo.

The security proposal will be put to the Senate this week.

The army has already been seen on the streets of Naples, helping to resolve a long-running rubbish crisis.

Ten new dumps in the area are designated as military zones and are guarded as such.

Source

kookomula · Post by **kookomula** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 6:26 pm

Yeah, I've heard things are a little different in Naples.

Mark Gobell · Post by **Mark Gobell** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 6:40 pm

Before I read the Sky bit, my thoughts were to do with the violence that has been reported toward Italy's immigrant communities, specifically the Roma iirc.

If you google naples + rubbish, this tale has been going on for years with mafia connections to waste disposal etc.

What to make of this?

acrobat74 · Post by **acrobat74** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 6:41 pm

Mark Gobell wrote:Italy Calls On Army To Help Fight Crime

Updated:14:37, Monday June 16, 2008

Army will be used as 'a deterrent'

The government wants to use the army alongside local police officers for "specific and exceptional crime-prevention missions".

Defence Minister Ignazio La Russa said the proposal was designed as a deterrent and a "demonstration of the presence of the state".

A few tanks on the streets would be even more of a presence.

They could also try air strikes.

Only against suspected mafioso sites of course...oops, might have to start with the Premier's residence.

It's perfectly safe in a gulag. What a mess.

simplesimon · Post by **simplesimon** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 7:10 pm

I saw soldiers on the streets of Palermo in 1997. My Italian friend told me that they came and went, according to the "threat level" (to paraphrase).

Seems to me that states like to have a low level, relatively contained war going on in a small, preferably poor and remote part of their territory.

Still, a very worrying escalation. As the European superstate develops, what's good for one conquered nation is good for another. We give them 42 days, they give us military on the streets. The French throw in draconian internet suppression. The Germans contribute thought crime laws. It's called harmonisation.

Mark Gobell · Post by **Mark Gobell** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 7:36 pm

simplesimon wrote:It's called harmonisation.

Awesome.

kookomula · Post by **kookomula** » Mon Jun 16, 2008 9:24 pm

[quote="simplesimon"]Still, a very worrying escalation. As the European superstate develops, what's good for one conquered nation is good for another. We give them 42 days, they give us military on the streets. The French throw in draconian internet suppression. The Germans contribute thought crime laws. It's called harmonisation.[/quote]

When you talk about suppression of the internet in France do you mean taxation or the sale of nazi memorabilia to French citizens. When you talk about thought crime do you mean section 18, para 52, point 14 of the things we're not allowed to mention in the rules and quite frankly the bunch of t***ers who go around nicking peoples bags and ruining their holidays (Naples) may well deserve whatever they get.

Reality - the drama

Reflecter · Post by **Reflecter** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 1:26 pm

Whilst highly unlikely, we can see little benefit to this troop presence, so would a repeat Bologna operation complete with a wonderous response from the armed forces, perhaps help to bolster the case for martial policing becoming a recommendation?