Paul Stott and Class War

[PaulStott]

Are you seriously denying you claimed to be from Class War on Indymedia?

Of course I am. Responding to your schizoid accusations could take a lifetime which is why I don't bother.

Tony I have in my hand a print out from Indymedia's webcast news from 2002.

On 14 Jan 2002 at 7.25pm you posted on Indymedia the following article: "The Class War/Mi5 Files" by Class War.

We know it was you because you then went on to actually inform readers that the article was extracted from issue 34 of your Pepis bulletin. (Or do you now deny writing that as well?)

Going round claiming to be from Class War was despicable, and I am not surprised you now choose to lie about it - especially as it did you serious damage at the time within Indymedia circles.

For Class War's 2002 take on this impersonation, see the link below:

http://lemming.mahost.org/classwar/gosling.htm

Indymedia have I understand removed your nonsense, but those in the Truth movement looking for the culprit who allegedly posted fake We Are Change statements on Indymedia may do well to consider that you have previous form with this tactic.

Oh - and whilst I'm on, lets quote from your fake Class War statement so the people on this board can see just how radical you are:

"Any spooks reading from this who wish to leak info to me which does not jeopardise national security (as opposed to the security of a New World 'Festung Europa' order) but feel the public should know about...??
You know how to do it and you know where I am"

[TonyGosling]

On 14 Jan 2002 at 7.25pm you posted on Indymedia the following article: "The Class War/Mi5 Files" by Class War.

My post "The Class War/MI5 Files" on Indymedia I used the byline 'by Class War'
Are you bananas?
Or just a bullshitter?

So an article with no byline becomes 'seemingly by Class War' has mutated to 'by Class War'.
As I said Schizophrenic and irellevant to this thread.
You're now confined to critics corner permanently
any postings out of there and you're suspended.

See this if you can be bothered
http://www.bilderberg.org/legal.htm#bone

[Larry O'Hara]

So, Gosling posts on Indymedia, pretending to be Class War (the words 'By Class War' give a clue).

He denies it, and when Paul cites chapter and verse (above), removes the post from the original thread on Prince William, so it looks like I made an unsubstantiated allegation.

For good measure, adds a hilarious 'advisory' to my avatar that nothing I say is to be trusted--coming from him, an accolade indeed. Now been changed to 'may post in critics corner' only.

Not content with lying, palpably so, Gosling then throws around psychiatric terminology like 'schizophrenic'.

For good measure, he even adds a fictitious title to this thread--calling it Paul Stott & Class War, whereas the real title (if you want to have one) should be 'Gosling caught out lying about Class War'

And this is the person who claims he should be put in permanent charge of this 'discussion' forum!

All I would say is this: putting Gosling in permanent charge here is as eloquent a confirmation of the intellectually threadbare, evidence-free, cult-like nature of the 9/11 Denial Movement: so, go ahead and do it!! Giving Gosling supreme power shows exactly what type of a 'movement' you really are--reactionary, venomous, dictatorial, petty, spiteful and (thankfully) doomed to failure. Which will leave space for those of us genuinely committed to investigative research & holding the secret state/ruling class to account.

I have a career path suggestion for Mr Gosling--why not submit a resume of your actions as Web-Censor on this thread to the Chinese Embassy, and offer your services as host of a Beijing-controlled 'Tibetan Truth Forum', devoted to discussing how the Mossad-controlled Dalai Lama is head of an evil religious sect which even uses human skulls as ornaments, and is devoted to disrupting the wonderful democracy that is China today? They#ll love it! And take particular care to emphasise just how little you know (or care) about anything resembling historical evidence.

[chrisc]

Indymedia have I understand removed your nonsense

Indymedia doesn't remove articles, this appears to be the one you are referring to:

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2002/01/20332.html

those in the Truth movement looking for the culprit who allegedly posted fake We Are Change statements on Indymedia may do well to consider that you have previous form with this tactic.

It seems fairly clear to me that the fake We Are Change and fake Truth Action posts were probably from the person / people behind the Truth Watch UK site.

[PaulStott]

That's a later one - the original was posted at 7.25pm on 14/1/02 and contained the words "by Class War".

On this one Gosling has simply removed the word "by", although it still demonstrates he was masquerading as a member of a group he has never been involved in, and was willing to smear that group by uncritically repeating whatever David Shayler's line was on that particular day.

[Alex_V]

I must say that this comes across as a load of trumped-up nonsense - a conspiracy theory, if you like. I don't see what the relevance is to... well... anything!

[chrisc]

That's a later one - the original was posted at 7.25pm on 14/1/02 and contained the words "by Class War".

I suspect it's the same one, what was the original URL when the article was on the original site -- if the URL contains the number 20332 then it is the same one.

Also the posting date, 2002-01-14 23:25, is US time -- the server was not set to UK time, so since the minute matches this is another indication that it's the same article... also there are no other articles on the site with the title "The Class War/MI5 Files" -- this is the only one...

On this one Gosling has simply removed the word "by"

Hmm, dunno, I wasn't involved with Indymedia in 2002 so I don't know if Tony would have had access to do that or if someone else did it to make it clear that it wasn't posted by Class War or if the "by" text was added by the templates that were in use by the CMS used at the time it was published...

Can you post the original URL of the article, it should be on your printout, we might be able to find it on archive.org...

[chrisc]

For Class War's 2002 take on this impersonation, see the link below:

http://lemming.mahost.org/classwar/gosling.htm

Which contains a link to the Indymedia UK newswire:

http://uk.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=20332

Which shows that it is the same article... the article ID's match, 20332.

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2002/01/20332.html

If it's indexed by archive.org (which seems to be down, perhaps they got swamped with traffic after this: FBI Gag order against the Internet Archive is rescinded) they will have it here:

web.archive.org/web/*/http://uk.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=20332

And perhaps then we can discoved if the "by" was added by the template or was part of the author field... In addition if the article was produced using a print template then that could have added the "by"...

Incidentally the article on the Class War site doesn't appear to claim that the original article contained a "by" in the author field, if it did it might have read, seemingly posted by "by Class War":

Can I make it clear that the thread "The Class War/MI5 Files" seemingly posted by Class War at 7.25pm on Monday 14 Jan 2002 was not posted by a Class War member, or even a supporter. As becomes clear when you read the text it was posted by Tony Gosling.

It's not really clear to me that Tony Gosling was "claiming to be from Class War" or "pretending to be Class War" or that he was "was masquerading as a member of a group he has never been involved in" or that it was "impersonation"... These are exaggerated claims -- if you read the article it's clearly not from a Class War supporter but from Tony Gosling... It is made of 3 parts, 1. written by Tony Gosling and then 2. a letter from Paul March to Tony and then 3. Tony's reply to Paul... That it was posted by Tony Gosling is made clear in the article on the Class war site...

It seems to me that Tony simply put the text "Class War" in the author field when he submitted the article -- anyone can post any article as anyone using Indymedia since there is no registration or checking of users identities when material is posted... perhaps Tony Gosling will confirm or deny that he posted this article...

But I dunno if it's worth spending any more time on this... it is a bit of an old story...

[TonyGosling]

It's clearly by me and not by Class War.

[PaulStott]

It seems to me that Tony simply put the text "Class War" in the author field when he submitted the article --

My point entirely - indeed one I have been making for 6 years!

[TonyGosling]

I think you might have missed the point of the article Paul. And the fact that it is very clearly by me.

I can't honestly deny posting it on Indymedia because it's five years ago now and it's the first time anyone's asked me about it but I have always put my own name, never a pseudonym, on things I've posted on Indymedia.
But I don't expect you to believe me, you've already made your mind up.

If you've got the conviction to publish something you should also have the convictions to put your name to it. I hope you agree.

My point entirely - indeed one I have been making for 6 years!