TIME TO STREAMLINE THE MOVEMENT?

[optimus79]

As much as this forum is a great place to discuss the 9/11 truth movement I cant help but feel its almost symptomatic of what is wrong with the movement right now.

I am firmly against the "no plane" theory, I don't wish to hear about it, and to see it discussed at great length is frustrating as IMO it shows a complete lack of common sense with regards to what can help get this movement out there in to the mainstream without question.

Now I am no computer whizz and the notion of making a website is far beyond me, but I would really like to see a more stream lined attack.

What with all the research that has been done in various quarters I still cant help feeling that it all feels so disjointed.

For this to really move forward I think there needs to be a an actual list of accusations or "charges" if you will. Something that the majority can really stand behind and issue to those who are yet to come across the movement.

Something that we can quote easily and without having to be drawn in to a debate over the more illogical aspects such as no planes or passenger switching etc.

I dont know whether it should be primarily another website, but it needs to combine the strong irrefutable evidence put together by the likes of Steven E Jones and David Griffin et al.

Its all very well talking about what we think may have happened for endless hours, but for this to get anywhere it needs a strong directed argument, signed/petitioned or whatever else.

With the backing of Griffin, Jones and every other respectable name we can get, then signed by as many people worldwide.

asking questions and making direct accusations are very different, until we get an argument strong enough to be able to make direct accusations then I feel we will continue to go in circles.

[prole art threat]

As much as this forum is a great place to discuss the 9/11 truth movement I cant help but feel its almost symptomatic of what is wrong with the movement right now.

I am firmly against the "no plane" theory, I don't wish to hear about it, and to see it discussed at great length is frustrating as IMO it shows a complete lack of common sense with regards to what can help get this movement out there in to the mainstream without question.

Now I am no computer whizz and the notion of making a website is far beyond me, but I would really like to see a more stream lined attack.

What with all the research that has been done in various quarters I still cant help feeling that it all feels so disjointed.

For this to really move forward I think there needs to be a an actual list of accusations or "charges" if you will. Something that the majority can really stand behind and issue to those who are yet to come across the movement.

Something that we can quote easily and without having to be drawn in to a debate over the more illogical aspects such as no planes or passenger switching etc.

I dont know whether it should be primarily another website, but it needs to combine the strong irrefutable evidence put together by the likes of Steven E Jones and David Griffin et al.

Its all very well talking about what we think may have happened for endless hours, but for this to get anywhere it needs a strong directed argument, signed/petitioned or whatever else.

With the backing of Griffin, Jones and every other respectable name we can get, then signed by as many people worldwide.

asking questions and making direct accusations are very different, until we get an argument strong enough to be able to make direct accusations then I feel we will continue to go in circles.

It's called FREE SPEECH, so SHUT UP! (ahem)

[fixuplooksharp]

[quote="optimus79"]As much as this forum is a great place to discuss the 9/11 truth movement I cant help but feel its almost symptomatic of what is wrong with the movement right now.

I am firmly against the "no plane" theory, I don't wish to hear about it, and to see it discussed at great length is frustrating as IMO it shows a complete lack of common sense with regards to what can help get this movement out there in to the mainstream without question.

Now I am no computer whizz and the notion of making a website is far beyond me, but I would really like to see a more stream lined attack.

What with all the research that has been done in various quarters I still cant help feeling that it all feels so disjointed.

For this to really move forward I think there needs to be a an actual list of accusations or "charges" if you will. Something that the majority can really stand behind and issue to those who are yet to come across the movement.

Something that we can quote easily and without having to be drawn in to a debate over the more illogical aspects such as no planes or passenger switching etc.

I dont know whether it should be primarily another website, but it needs to combine the strong irrefutable evidence put together by the likes of Steven E Jones and David Griffin et al.

Its all very well talking about what we think may have happened for endless hours, but for this to get anywhere it needs a strong directed argument, signed/petitioned or whatever else.

With the backing of Griffin, Jones and every other respectable name we can get, then signed by as many people worldwide.

asking questions and making direct accusations are very different, until we get an argument strong enough to be able to make direct accusations then I feel we will continue to go in circles.[/quote]

[color=red]
i completely agree[/color]

[Bushwacker]

Sorry, but I think it is difficult to stick purely to pointing out anomalies in the official story, because the immediate response will be "So what did happen then?" and if the answer is that no one knows, that is very unconvincing.

You would have hoped that by now emerging evidence would have lead to a clear narrative of what actually did happen, but rather surprisingly this has not occurred, and no one has yet managed to put the pieces of the jigsaw together to make a picture we can all recognise and accept.

[marky 54]

again i take on board the no plane theory openmindedly again i do a few checks of footage and again i cannot support it, i agree with the first post in here. i always approach things in a way that i could be wrong which is the only reason i give a little time to looking at it, but no more. time is important and i will not reply to anymore no plane threads and stray away from more important evidence.

[uselesseater]

Wether there is any truth or none in the 'no plane' theory, I think there are far stronger arguments with much harder evidence than the 'no plane' theory will ever have.

I don't think we should tell anyone what to say, but we should always be concious of making the most of the few oportunities we have to try and communicate information to people.

[MiniMauve]

I understand your point, Optimus, but I don't think there is anything terribly wrong with the movement atm. Nor do I think there is anything terribly wrong with the forum itself, for the most part. NPT would probably long ago have died the death it deserves on this forum (same as most other theories that have shaky evidence to support them), were it not for the efforts of one poster who continually revives it.

[ian neal]

I realise it is difficult for campaigners who are new to this network/website/campaign and hence to the history of who we all are and how we got to be here

But it won't surprise you to know that these type of suggestions and discussions have been had before. It will hopefully please you to know that athere is just such a project as the one you propose. A site that will in effect represent the first best attempt of the campaign to present our case professionally is in development

It will take time to get a feel for what is happening and who is who and who is involved in what but some searching of the forum on key people and issues reveals most of our background

[blackcat]

We should be far more concerned with asking questions that speculating on "answers". How could the buildings fall at almost freefall speed? How could all of Norad fail so spectacularly? Where is the airplane wreckage at the Pentagon. Why not release the Pentagon videos? Why the resistance to an enquiry and why did Bush not testify under oath? These questions and a multitude of others should be the basis of demanding a full and proper enquiry.

Purporting to have answers, even ludicrous ones such as holograms, is not what this movement should be about. By all means use evidence such as free fall speed to suggest that other means of collapse must have occurred and demand an enquiry on that basis, but to offer convoluted scenarios such as holograms or faked videos makes us a laughing stock. Which of course is what many people want.

[Pikey]

Blackcat states:-

We should be far more concerned with asking questions that speculating on "answers". How could the buildings fall at almost freefall speed? How could all of Norad fail so spectacularly? Where is the airplane wreckage at the Pentagon. Why not release the Pentagon videos? Why the resistance to an enquiry and why did Bush not testify under oath? These questions and a multitude of others should be the basis of demanding a full and proper enquiry.

Purporting to have answers, even ludicrous ones such as holograms, is not what this movement should be about. By all means use evidence such as free fall speed to suggest that other means of collapse must have occurred and demand an enquiry on that basis, but to offer convoluted scenarios such as holograms or faked videos makes us a laughing stock. Which of course is what many people want.

Spot on IMHO Blackcat. The David Ray Griffin approach and as far as I'm concerned its the most effective and powerful way forward. Saturday night at Conwy Hall was testimony to that!

I suggest a suitably titled section on this website to facilitate debate eg. "speculating what really happened"

The setting up of the official/corporate 911 website was agreed at the Committee meeting held in Blackpool in February.

When somebody comes up with some compelling evidence to support the no plane theory then it will get my attention. To date I've not seen any of that.

[Bicnarok]

Maybe a "Really serious facts only" thread should be created to satisfy the logical thinkers.